I was gonna wait for more reviews to actually confirm it. But why bother, it' s probably true anyway. IGN said TOCA wonderfully maintains 30fps even online. I mean, if i wanted another 30fps racing game i would just play FORZA!, which has achieved graphics TOCA 3 can' t even come close to. TOCA 3 was supposed to be my last big hurrah before the Xbox went the way of the Dreamcast. Sadly, this isn' t so. Hmmm, wait, maybe Black or Dreamfall can take it' s place now.

That really sucks, considering Toca 2 was 60fps.

No racing game should be running at anything less than 60fps on hardware at Dreamcast level and beyond. Hell, Sega' s Model 2 board did 60fps on all it' s games and Namco' s older PS One based hardware did it on most.

Exactly the reason I returned PGR3. With PGR2 I accepted it as maybe they couldn' t get enough power out of the Xbox to do it, but with PGR3 it was unacceptable. With the kind of power devs have access to it simply comes down to sloppy programming and rushing games out for release.

I was gonna wait for more reviews to actually confirm it

Hardly any reviews on mainstream site even bother to mention framerates anymore. It' s as though they think people don' t really care anymore.

I guess journalism isn' t what it used to be. Thank god for the likes of Kikizo and games TM magazine.

Forza was crap for me - the gameplay sux at 30fps.I think that next installment could kick some serious ass.

Hehe, the standard line used by review sites now when a game is 30fps is, " rock solid framerate" , or " consistent framerate" . If you see something like that then it' s sure to be around the 30fps mark. Once in a while, a game comes along at 60fps and the common description is something like, " silky-smooth framerate" or " silky smooth 60fps" . I' ve encountered a review before where a 60fps game was described as having a framerate as smooth as a knife cutting through hot butter!

Come to think of it, i think this is Codemasters' first ever racing game not to run at 60fps? Hehe, i think i might just get ToCa 2, i was actually planning to already get ToCa 2 a few months ago, it was just ToCa 3 that was making me wait.

Interestingly though Kyo.k, you returned PGR3? i was kinda thinking that maybe because it had motion blur, that it would be quite acceptable to the eyes, even for a 30fps racing game?

It was acceptably smooth, but noticeably worse than 60fps. Compared to Ridge Racer 6, or even the arcade version of Daytona USA (1994) I didn' t think it was smooth enough, especially for a next-gen game.

I did spend close to 18 hours playing through it though, and it was a lot of fun. But really I expected more framerate wise, which is why I prefered Ridge Racer (Plus the whole artistic flair it has).

I don' t find 30fps bad for things like Resi 4 and Halo, and if Halo 3 didn' t do 60 then altough I would be dissapointed, I wouldn' t mind so much. Ultimately fast moving games like fighters and racing games are better suited to high framerates, whereas on titles like Resi 4 it isn' t so important if it' s smooth enough.

Anyway, I wouldn' t even consider another racing game unless it was 60fps. Having said that I see no reason other than lazy development, why all games cannot run at 60fps. I willing to bet that Far Cry on 360 won' t be 60 even though the machine can easiliy handle it. My PC can do it at 1024x768 no probs, and the 360' s way more powerfull than my PC.

Hopefully developers realise that 60fps is the way to go and stop making up crap like " you can' t notice more than 30" , because you can, very easily.

Whats up with western developers thinking 30fps fpr racers (and in some cases FPS' s) is acceptable?

Classic case is PGr3, yuk, the game jerks when after playing the supersmooth RR6.. Even my 8 year old nephew noticed the smoothness difference.

Exactly. Bizzare Creations simply rushed out the game in time for the 360' s already rushed out launch.

They did say they were going for 60fps, but at the last minute stated that they didn' t have enough time with final dev kits to achieve this. I think they had about two months tops. And in order to optimise the game you would have to re-write a lot of code to take advantage of the 3 CPU cores which devs didn' t have access to fully in unfinished kits.

I think as the average mainstream gamer doesn' t really care about this, then devs will continue to settle for sub-standard framerates.

jars, don' t put away ur xbox just yet, painkiller hell wars is coming out on the 28 of this month, if that interests u.

Hehe, i' m not putting it away anytime soon. I' m just saying that after getting ToCa 3, that would be the last game i' d ever want to get of all the games yet to come on the Xbox.

Painkiller Hell Wars eh? i' ll check it out. I' ll also see how good Black and Dreamfall are.

hmmmm gears of war is also 30fps, and thats the best looking 360 title i know of.

...You better start saving for the ps3 then, with 120fps!

hmmmm gears of war is also 30fps, and thats the best looking 360 title i know of.

How do you know?

thats its the best looking title? the e3 vids where jerk-o-vision, also ild rather less game details and effects @60fps than more @30fps.

That I perosnally know of. I dont have a 360 so i am not into all the upcoming games for it, i cant possibley know of every game being made for all consoles. But i think the unreal engine 3 looks sweet. Fight Night round 3 is also easy on the eye.

GoW is a different kind of game - Halo 2 was 30fps and it wasn' t a problem , but in racers it seems like cars are less responsive for me (still I liked PGR2).


Another genre that is totally unplayable for me in 30fps - fighting games.

For me FPS' s at 60fps would be so sweet, but since it' s not a norm, on any console, then it' s acceptable at 30fps. Especially if it looks like GOW or Halo 2. I think the only 60fps first-person shooter i can remember is Outrigger, by Yu Suzuki, for the Dreamcast.

Yeah, definitely pure racing games and fighting games should be 60fps. For me though something like GTA doesn' t have to be. RPG' s at 60fps are unheard of though, so it doesn' t matter.

I SPOKE TOO SOON!!!!

http://community.codemasters.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78120&highlight=framerate

I knew it!! I knew Codemasters wouldn' t let me down! In this world where framerate takes second place to sales, Codemasters is one of the few companies that always mentions, " all at a rock solid 60fps" in their features list.

Excellent! More companies should be doing this. Maybe then we' ll be closer to a world where every game runs at 60fps, as it should be.

For me FPS' s at 60fps would be so sweet, but since it' s not a norm, on any console, then it' s acceptable at 30fps. Especially if it looks like GOW or Halo 2. I think the only 60fps first-person shooter i can remember is Outrigger, by Yu Suzuki, for the Dreamcast.

Metroid Prime - one of the best looking current gen games and solid 60fps.

I think the priority for games should be 60fps and then some - not for all the games - like you said RPG games and some other are just as good in 30.

I think it' s just stupid that games for 360 are in 30 fps now since most of them barely touches it' s power.

I think it' s a lame excuse to say " it' s new and hard" - that doesn' t explain the framerate drops.

Optimise our games you lazy fuckin bastards !

Prime is an great example.

You can still have a great-looking FPS and @ 60fps, Ok the drawdisance isnt that great in Prime (given the nature of the games levels) but it still pushes out great details and spot-FX while mantaining constant 60fps.

Nintendo really do Have the highest ' Seal of Quality' Anyway, Even most DS games runs no less than 60fps..


I mean how imbarrising was it when after playing PGR3 i went and played MK:DS and the first thing i said was

' OMG! HOW SMOOTH IS THIS!!'

MK:DS beats the living c^%^ outta PGR3 anyway so no suprize.