Whats' the point of 360' s hardaware innovations when months after it' s launch the very same games are much better on a high-end PC?

Everyone knows about Oblivion now and Quake 4 was rushed for a launch title so it may not count, but soon GRAW comes out for the PC and it has bigger levels , fantastic new physics and other features that really make it stand out (check www.ign.com for hands-on).

(It' s now FPP only)

Those visual upgrades should be in 360 GRAW in the first place.

I' ve never seen a console that would struggle with PC titles in it' s first year of existence.

Lazy fuckin PC developers...

I somehow get the impression that you don' t like PCs and the 360.

Actually as my friend said,who sit on a 3800 amd 7800 gt 256mb(not sli) it doesnt look fun that graw,first the fps action looks quite bizzare,check the videos at IGN,also you must press up a map,and then you have like 10000 optionsto choose for your A.I comrades that is spread out on the map.

Looks very stupid and dull.

However quake4 should be played on pc,ofc if you doesnt have a pc that can handle it,then get the 360 version,i finished the pc and loved it though.
Ofc it was no AAA title but its fun...

Also remember this,360 version off OB sold more,why? piracy ofc,and expensive hardward changes with a pc.

And look at doom3?
You need freaking tripple the specc of the xbox to make it run well on a pc.
I still cant belive how they made it looking that good with that kind of machine O_o

Anyway,mass effect,blue dragon and too human will show you how a console game should be played,just you wait man :)

I dont listen to any C%^P about how great these next-gen consols Graphics cards are and how they ' own' PC ones...


It all depends on what spec PC you have anyway..

I just feel sorry for the people out there who listen ‘too much’ into what the ' press' and ' Fanboys' are telling them..

One of my 360-owning friends came round the other day with a copy of 360 (nice water but thats about it) farcry and We had a little mess about with that, then played abit of fight night etc.

After I asked him if he’d ever seen or played games on a high-spec PC ? He said he hasn’t but stated he read that he' s not missing much as the 360 card was better than any current PC graphic card anyway..


SO..

I unplugged my 360 ‘VGA cable’ and Fed my PC thru the same CRT projector (these are ' high end' projectors )

I showed him a few games such as Quake 4, Half life 2, and Farcry 1...




These following quotes are what I remember him saying while watching them in action:

“JESUS CHRIST!! that looks CLEAR man"

" NO WAY!!, that looks out of this world mann!! (HLF life 2)"

" the natural lighting and clarity look unreal!" (HL2)

" Mostly silent (Farcry) he before went on about how the 360 version had better graphics (this was BEFORE he saw it running on a high-spec PC )"

" you really feel like your there man" (HL2)

" these are the smoothest games ive ever seen! i dint know games can run at this smoothness!"

" Damm..that owns my 360 version" ( i think that was while playing quake 4)

***An hour later***

" Can you build me a PC like yours??, ill sell my 360 give you all my games for building it and give you the cash for the parts!"

I' m now actually in the process of building him A killer PC (and i have his 360 games)


BTW the best PC - console FPS conversion ive played/seen so far is without doubt the Dreamcast version of ' Quake 3' although it ran at 30fps, it played ' EXACTLY' like the PC version with M&K..

DC quake 3, actually lead me to buying a gaming PC in the 1st place.. Ive still yet to play ANY console FPS that plays anywhere near as good as that game (mainly due to it being ' Qauke 3' and the flawless M&K controls.

I somehow get the impression that you don' t like PCs and the 360

I' m not a PC fan that' s for sure - I like to play my games without problems and installations and all that crap.

As for 360 - I think it' s not the system but some PC developers.

I think it sux that so many 360' s simply die on you , but they will replace it with upgraded model.

What good are photorealistic graphics if they move like retro games? Have you seen animals turning around in oblivion?

The problem lies in developement.

It sux to have downgraded graphics (comparing to current PCs) on your brand new console - it means it will get even worse next year.Hopefully,some games made with mainly 360 in mind, will show it' s potential.

Fhunter wtf are you talking about?

basically far cry to 360 was a port of the xbox game with some added levels but better looking water.

Gonna be fun when he put on mass effect,gears of war or too human what are you gonna show him then?

Nothing?

:P


And to Gangsta In OB,they have everything om maxium,but have longer distance on pc version,however on 360 they use Both HDR+AA,while on PC you have to choose,and most people on PC use HDR,however then you will see small jaggies overall.

360 version in Ob is kick ass!!!

I somehow get the impression that you don' t like PCs and the 360.

...that might true, but i strongly emphasise with his comments in general...
.....HOW much more powerful is 360 compared to current top PCs?.. ...and 360 games look inferior?.... ...what kind of BS is that???....

...and isn' t GR:AW an example of 360 better abilities?....

...i tell you most PC devs are either lazy, incompetent or simply just don' t give a f*ck about the quality of the games they release for consoles...

... perhaps they also think of console gamers as being too retarded to notice...

...like..

PC Dev Boss: " uunh lets wait a year before releasing our beta version for those sub playstaion fan-boys... ...dumb f*cks should of forgotten about our bad@$$ PC version by then"

PC Lead Programmer: " oh wait boss. The MS guys just released a new machine and they want our best stuff for it now, to help with promotion and marketing"

PC Dev Boss: " that a fact huh?
hmmmm...
ok, release the beta version first, then we' ll like, stop playing
multiplayer doom and release the proper version for our mini tower
brothers a month or two later.
Ha! those joypad users will never know, MWWAAHHAHAHHA!!

The 360 use a card that is even better then a 7800 gt 512 mb card,well i would ask anyone here which pc games that being dev for a 512mb 3d card that is the best at the market at this moment?
Many time if you have the best card at the moment will let you play some game at the best graphic,but then dev doesnt optimizte or dev for that in mind to take advantage of that card.
Also remember that the dev kit for 360 was a x800 in mind,thats why beathsed said,recommend specc are x800,youi see x800 can play it at highest.
However xenon should be compared to a x1800xt 512mb

Also Its not a 3ghz cpu its 3x 3.2 ghz ,ofc it has 512 ram,but console games often doesnt req much more ram,seeing how it only works on the game,and most games arnt made for something as big or open ended as in OB and still it works fine.

It sux to have downgraded graphics (comparing to current PCs) on your brand new console - it means it will get even worse next year.Hopefully,some games made with mainly 360 in mind, will show it' s potential.

The problem at the moment is that developers are still getting used to the multi-cored, multi-threaded architecture and the fact that they don' t yet have XNA proper.

As far as Advanced Warfighter on PC is concerned, ...to get it looking better/as good on PC than it looks on a 360 & HDTV, you' d need a beast of a PC.

The only thing the PC version really has going for it is the physics, and that' s something will drains available juice from your machine.

Anyone who' d played the game on 360 and got to the rooftop level where you take out checkoints will attest to it being absolutely gorgeous, moreso than many of the other levels. The thing is, i haven' t seen any screenshots OF that level and i don' t know why.

The FPP isn' t something i really want from this title, although i can see the appeal to PC gamers.



Quake 4 on 360 was awful, but i didn' t like it on PC either.

PDZ is rubbish.

Oblivion is almost identical to it' s PC counterpart but has some minor downcomings.

CoD2 is amazing on both 360 AND PC, it' s easily one of my favourite games.

...and i' d rather play the 360 version of GRAW than the PC version, but that' s just me.

Yes,me and my friend wont bother getting the GRAW pc version.
It looked very strange in action,looks like you play rainbow six in fps... O_o
And you move your A.I over a bizzare map.

No thx!!

And yes i have played Quake4 it look the same on my pc and plays much better,however CoD2 plays much much better on my 360 then pc,ofc i only played the demo of those 2 games on the 360,and whole game on my pc.

And none of those games look as good as GRAW SP if you ask me.

PS! Majik said pdz was rubbish,well it has awesome graphic O_o V

Gangsta has a " thing" for developers who make PC games. Somehow he got it into his head that if you make pc games, you have to slack, and only japaneese game makers are perfect, and sometimes i think he' d like us to believe that all japaneese make good games.

I dont see any problem with GRAW or Oblivion, i think both are superb. Loading times arent really Bethesdas fault since MS were stupid enough to exclude the harddrive. GRAW, well the PC version has a longer development time so that gives them the chance to put some extra stuff in it, like RE4 for PS2.

Quake 4, i must say i loved it when i completed it on the 360, through and through, much better than PDZ. They should have spent a month more on optimization.

maybe we should just have a sticky here where Gangsta can write " I dislike PC game developers, and non japaneese"

what you said is true Gangsta, never seen a console struggles with pc at its release , but i guess one of the factors that narrowed the gap is the HD.

and i never thought oblivion or GRAW a next gen game, let alone Quake 4, graphic wise.

for me next gen is Gears of war and above.

GRAW is very much next gen graphic so is OB.
They both use pixel shader 3.0,which is a next gen feature only on the highst pc cards.


Anyone who says GRAW/OB doesnt look next gen havnt tried those games.
They also used good use of blurr effects when heli or tanks move,look extremly realistic.


ABO you gonna get very dissapointed at the graphics from ps3 if you doesnt consider this next gen...












I mean what are you gonna say when you put in your " Untold Legends: Dark Kingdom" and it look like this?




PS! i dont want to tell you how i know this,but at a site they burned down GRAW for 360,and it was 3.6 gb big.

Ahum...

360 dual layer dvd is over 9 gb.

bye!
Oh btw i saw OB it was 6.4 gb.
Half of the space is taking up by the voice recording(they have over 50 hours of voice recording) obs not just sound, or effects,but 50 hours voice records,and thos etook 3 gb,for ex in a final fantasy game they speak in importent event,in OB they speak all the time :P

GRAW is very much next gen graphic so is OB.
They both use pixel shader 3.0,which is a next gen feature only on the highst pc cards.

God this is the kind of talk that dissimforms people like my friend i mentioned in my last post...

What the hell is ' pixel shader 3.0' when the overall resolution, clrarity, brightness and smoothness are well below what a good high-specd PC offers.


Comparing console games to PC ones, is just piontless.. Especially next year, when the new 4ghz Intel dual core' s will be around.

Look at ninja gaiden and resident evil4 not many pc games that had graphic like those.

On pc they have to take in memory to diffrent hardwares and cant opitmizes for a single one,that why half life 2+doom3 work on a xbox,even though its should be impossible,and still look awesome.

Pixel shader 3.0 is a think that handle the lighting in the game,for ex i got a radeon 9800 pro 256mb 3dcard it has pixel shader 2.0 OB req 2.0.

Also OB had another hi end thing called HDR.
Most pc card have a problem running them both on.
if they even can.



" A shader is a program used in 3D computer graphics to determine the final surface properties of an object or image. This can include arbitrarily complex descriptions of light absorption and diffusion, texture mapping, reflection and refraction, shadowing, surface displacement and post-processing effects. By design, the shaders are ideal candidates for parallel execution by multiple graphic processors, located at video card, allowing for scalable multiprocessing and CPU relief from rendering issues (this feature enables exploiting video adapters for general-purpose parallel computation). Because the scope of shaders is much more limited than general programs, they are usually written using a shading language, a specifically designed programming language."


When turning on and off pixel shader 3.0 you see a big diffrence on diffrent objects,its hard to explain but lights often reflect more true and make diffrent enviorment have a more true lighitng system.

I think some sites already testes pixel shader 1. somehting and then 2.0 and then 3.0 and you could see the diffrence,you need to google it.
However games that use Pixel shaders 3.0
is GRAW and OB,you see it at the characters and the lighthing from objects or items,for ex in OB you can see it at armors.

Comparing console games to PC ones, is just piontless.. Especially next year, when the new 4ghz Intel dual core' s will be around.

360 have 3 cores running in 3.2 ghz and ps3 seven cores running in 3.2 ghz...

However i doesnt like to attack pc gaming,seeing how its already on its knee slowly dying :P

360 have 3 cores running in 3.2 ghz

Yes, we already know that! Kind of the point of the thread tbh.. under performance..

However i doesnt like to attack pc gaming,seeing how its already on its knee slowly dying :P

IS it?? god i didnt know that, i thought PC-based engines (IR crytec, Untreal 3 engine).. PC games sales, PC online cummunity (WOW, CS, and all the other FPS' s) are doing extremely well .. but gee, thanks for telling me..

Glad im getting a Revolution now..

360 have 3 cores running in 3.2 ghz and ps3 seven cores running in 3.2 ghz...

No it doesn' t.

360 has 3 general purpose cores that are clocked at 3.2GHz yes, but PS3 only has one general purpose core.

It might have 7 available SPE' s but they aren' t counted as or able to do the same job as a general purpose core.

CELL isn' t much more advanced than Xenon and at least the latter is easier to use.

PS3 does NOT have seven 3.2 GHz cores!

IS it?? god i didnt know that

It is actually.

The console game industry saw 6.2 billion dollars in retail software sales in 2004, and PC saw only 1.2 billion in the same year.

The Console gaming industry is increasing by approx 8% per year while the PC gaming industry is slowly decreasing.

This year, with PS3 and Revolution launching, the console industry is expected to jump another 13%, maybe more.

I don' t know much, or care about, power or graphics but I do know one thing. The 360 is waaaaaaaaaay cheaper than a powerful PC. And with consoles you don' t have to go through installation and setup things for each machine. Going through the graphic options in PC games drives me crazy!
And a PC has to be upgraded all the time since the developers take the freedom to make games that simply require more power. With consoles the developers are instead forced to come up with smart solutions to make the graphics look better despite lacking power. In the case of the 360 it supposedly doesn' t lack power so it should be able to outperform powerful PCs. I think I agree with Gangsta here, the reason for some 360 games not being as good as PC games is simply due to lazy PC developers who doesn' t take time to come up with smart solutions.

The console game industry saw 6.2 billion dollars in retail software sales in 2004, and PC saw only 1.2 billion in the same year.

The Console gaming industry is increasing by approx 8% per year while the PC gaming industry is slowly decreasing.

Makes sense considering the PC piracy state is forever getting worse, as we get faster connections, more and more people are simply downloading PC games off torrents and alike..

Most PC gamers, know about hardware and software and would certainly know how to D/L a PC game.. nearly every one i know who owns a PC, never buys its games from retail (unless its a steam or MMOG one).. Sad really, cos their killing their own plattform..