i' m sure that either me or you are total lunatic...

let' s just be precise, are u talking about dreamcast vs first year ps2 ?? or dreamcast vs ps2 simple ?,

if it' s the first i would definitly agree, dreamcast was beter than ps2, but after that ps2 picked up result DC ====> dead

i don' t care if it' s sony' s fucking money, or hyping or just name it, the thing is very good games were and are on ps2 today, coparing the whole console life to DC life is pure bullshit.

Not quite true but Shenmue walks over every RPG anyway!

i swear i wonder sometimes if soem people are on crack here when they write stuff on this forum.

first of all shenmue is not a RPG it' s an advenure game, we know what' s RPG is, at least we gamers know what rpg is, you can argue with me but that' s your problem.

please, when you talk about rpg' s, be sure to mention skies of arcadia or at least grandia 2 which are the best rpg' s i can consider on that console , any otehr rpg on dreamcast is CRAP.

shenmue 2 is not a masterpiece , may be for you but for teh industry hell no, that game got so many fluctuations in its score, many poeple loved it, many people thought it' s average, and some even thought it was boring... we conclude then that it' s not an AAA

hey nobody can say Gran turismo 3 is a bad racing game
nobody can say that devil may cry is a bad action game
nobody can say final fantasy 7 is a bad rpg
nobody can say that virtua fighter is a bad fighting game
nobody say mario 64 is a bad platform game
and nobody would say golden eye or half life 2 is a bad fps

my point is , when there are so many people calling a game boring, bad gameplay , repettive, even if the otehr half think otehrwise, you can' t name that game anymore a masterpiece may be to you , but not to the industry? are we cool?

back to teh subject , ps2 has so many great and much beter rpg' s than DC ever had, i don' t fucking care if some of those games were realsed on the 3rd year or 4th year or second , we' re comparing both consoles in gneral.

The PS2 had its DVD-player but that' s all.
The Dreamcast had the first unified online service, visual memory cards, four controller slots, 60hz option and more.

the ps2 dvd feature is for the market much more important than a stupiud visual memory (yah it' s cool and what ??) and the 4 slots
Dc online didn' t work well , it was too early for this, only very very few games took advantage of it anyway.
almost all recent games (since 2 years ago) give the option of 60 hz, and that problem is only for pal territory anyway ( but not anymore)

quote:

NO GOOD SOCCER GAME in DC !!! ( virtua striker )

Ok... like I give a damn.

see you' re talking about yourself , so next time say DC is the best console ever FOR ME and THE FEW LIKE ME you might add :)
many people including me are interested in soccer game , and the abscence in DC was lethal...

Most of Segas franchises were there. 3rd party companies were bought by Sony. The money choose the PS2, not the quality.

like what ?? euuh sonic 1 which was hmm good the others sucked, then what ecco ? virtua fighter ?

let' s talk about sega 16bit that didn' t make it to teh dreamcast

i wanted shinobie
outrun
street of rage
golden axe
legend of thor
comix zone

let' s talk about the 32 bit era

panzer dragon
castlevania
metal gear
......... infinity that didn' t make it to DC which was a huuuuge disapointement since it was supposed to be a next generation , most of us expected to see these franchises on DC , it never happened even after 3 years

ps2 gamepad is better than DC pad... ginjirou what i really feel about your post is that you just want to contradict me hat' s all , specialy when you pointed out each and every comment of mine , man at least there should be some truth there , what i' m THAT stupid !!!

oh man enough already !! i' m sick this is rediculous comparing ps2 to DC is ridiculous

Ok you are being very provocative here but I' ll try to stay calm

let' s just be precise, are u talking about dreamcast vs first year ps2 ?? or dreamcast vs ps2 simple ?,

if it' s the first i would definitly agree, dreamcast was beter than ps2, but after that ps2 picked up result DC ====> dead

I' m talking about the time where DC and PS2 were sold at the same time which of course mainly is the first year of the PS2. Despite the lack of good titles on the PS2 and the amount of good titles on the DC the PS2 still sold better. Simply because the usuall Sony hype, their fanboys and the expected coming 3rd party titles.

i don' t care if it' s sony' s fucking money, or hyping or just name it, the thing is very good games were and are on ps2 today, coparing the whole console life to DC life is pure bullshit.

Well that means that Sony sucks since they don' t make good consoles, unlike the other companies that makes good ones.
Comparing the whole console life with the DC is very important since that explains why the PS2 has got more AAA titles. It' s pretty obvious that the PS2 has more AAA titles than the DC since it was " alive" more than twice as long. And that explains why the PS2 has got more AAA titles than the GC or the Xbox. It' s simply been around longer. It still sucks as a console.

first of all shenmue is not a RPG it' s an advenure game, we know what' s RPG is, at least we gamers know what rpg is, you can argue with me but that' s your problem.

I never meant that Shenmue was an RPG (it doesn' t really belong to any other genre than its own) but I still think it' s better than any RPG.

shenmue 2 is not a masterpiece , may be for you but for teh industry hell no, that game got so many fluctuations in its score, many poeple loved it, many people thought it' s average, and some even thought it was boring... we conclude then that it' s not an AAA

Shenmue 2 was concidered by many to be better than the first game and the first game mostly got top reviews. It' s an AAA title but as with everything in the world you can' t satisfy everyone. At least Shenmue was groundbreaking unlike all the RPG titles for the PS2.

hey nobody can say Gran turismo 3 is a bad racing game
nobody can say that devil may cry is a bad action game
nobody can say final fantasy 7 is a bad rpg
nobody can say that virtua fighter is a bad fighting game
nobody say mario 64 is a bad platform game
and nobody would say golden eye or half life 2 is a bad fps

Actually, you can and lots of people do.

my point is , when there are so many people calling a game boring, bad gameplay , repettive, even if the otehr half think otehrwise, you can' t name that game anymore a masterpiece may be to you , but not to the industry? are we cool?

I suppose you only hang out with Sony fanboys so I guess it' s understandable that you think people feel that way. Pretty much everyone admits that Shenmue was a groundbreaking title. The industry loved the game. The Sony fanboys didn' t and they are many.

back to teh subject , ps2 has so many great and much beter rpg' s than DC ever had, i don' t fucking care if some of those games were realsed on the 3rd year or 4th year or second , we' re comparing both consoles in gneral.

So you' re putting all the focus on RPG' s...ok.
The DC would' ve gotten great RPG' s to if it had been around longer, as the PS2. So the Dc doesn' t suck, it simply weren' t around long enough.
And you' re stupid if you don' t understand why we are comparing the first years. You really are. Stupid. I usually don' t mean that word but in this case I really mean it.

like what ?? euuh sonic 1 which was hmm good the others sucked, then what ecco ? virtua fighter ?

You don' t know what you' re talking about do you? Have you ever owned, played or even seen a Dreamcast?
Virtua Fighter, Sega Rally, Virtua Tennis, House of the Dead, Shenmue, Virtua Cop, Ecco, Daytona, Crazy Taxi, Headhunter, Sonic Adventure are just some examples. Those are more than Sony has ever had.

ginjirou what i really feel about your post is that you just want to contradict me hat' s all , specialy when you pointed out each and every comment of mine

Well since i disagree with you it would be most natural to answer all your arguments with my own, don' t you think?

oh man enough already !! i' m sick this is rediculous comparing ps2 to DC is ridiculous

Actually it' s not since the DC was a good console that failed and the PS2 was a bad console that succeeded. It is a very interesting discussion but I understand that a fanboy like you are having a hard time seeing your favourite console getting criticised with good arguments.

Shenmue and ???? Thats basically the only strong rpg on it at all.

Quake 3? Unreal tournament is way better.

People were surprised that Square took sides with Sony after a tech demo for FF6 for Nintendo' s new system.

You shouldn' t give a damn about Soccer games, they are one of the leading biggest hits in the market.

PS2 had 60 hz support, just not with color by the SCART that came with.

-

The ps2 dvd feature made me never buy a dvd player on the side, for that function I am thankful

The DC lacked games in many genres. I have it myself, and atleast here I was never able to get any tempting strong titles. I missed a great platformer, I missed a great modern fighting game, I missed a more true RPG than Shenmue was.

Quake 3? Unreal tournament is way better.

Oh please, are you joking?

The DC lacked games in many genres. I have it myself, and atleast here I was never able to get any tempting strong titles. I missed a great platformer, I missed a great modern fighting game, I missed a more true RPG than Shenmue was.

Once again, you never seem to get the point, the PS2 also lacked lots of genres and great titles but as I' ve said the PS2 has been around longer so now at the year of 2006, several years after the DC died, the PS2 does have most genres covered. If you don' t get the point now I' ll just give up trying to explain it to you.

wait a minute,unreal 2007 or quake 4?

Ofc soon comes wolfenstein,heck ... i love RTCW mp more then any other pc fps online game.

AND YES I KNOW THE NEW WOLFENSTEIN IS COMING FOR 360.
But the pc version for RTCW and the add on with ahum..forgot the name was just kick ass,i never tried the xbox version of RTCW,so cant judge it.

Once again, you never seem to get the point, the PS2 also lacked lots of genres and great titles but as I' ve said the PS2 has been around longer so now at the year of 2006, several years after the DC died, the PS2 does have most genres covered. If you don' t get the point now I' ll just give up trying to explain it to you

we don' t care about that, if ps2 has been longer or not , the truth is since ps2 has much much much interstin games than dreamcast, therefore it is a better console , this was the point of the discution...

i onwed a dreamcast and i played all AA and AAA tiles and soem crap games (like spawn or blue stinger) so please that console i knew it by heart and i had access to every single game, and see man that' s what might make the difference between us , dc library was poor.

don' t call me sony fanboy , hell no boy

Virtua Fighter, arcade
Sega Rally, aracde
Virtua Tennis, arcade
House of the Dead, arcade
Shenmue, no comment (oh i didn' t wanna talk about shenmue 2 but shenmue 1, i don' t know how i ended up putting that 2, and yes i know shenmue 2 was better than shenmue 1)
Virtua Cop, acrade
Ecco, good game by critics but i didn' t like it (i loved the graphics)
Daytona, aracde
Crazy Taxi, acrade
Headhunter, average game


did you notice something?? man as of that list i mentioned , i was talking about the games they were coming from the 16 bit era like shinobie taht didn' t make it to dreamcast ..

Actually, you can and lots of people do.

by people i mean , not the stupid ***s, i mean hardcore gamers, hell just gamers or critics.... 99% of critics thought devil may cry 1 was excellent, that percentage was not true about shenmue.

I also like the Onimusha series, I' ve always seen the devil may cry/onimusha as a paradox series, i went for Onimusha and became a fan instantly, loving the games more and more.

Wouldn' t a place like 1-up.com be better suited to sony fans?

Because this place may not agree with you.

whiteguysamurai , you can start talking about fanboys when you first take off sega' s logo from your avatar

we don' t care about that, if ps2 has been longer or not , the truth is since ps2 has much much much interstin games than dreamcast, therefore it is a better console , this was the point of the discution...

No the point of this discussion has become that the Dreamcast is better than the PS2 because the PS2 as hardware is a piece of crap but the software for it is great. Now do you get it?

dc library was poor.

As I said, it was never given the time the PS2 had to gain lots of AAA titles.

arcade

Something wrong with arcadegames? Most gamers love arcade games and they are very suitable for casual gamers. Except Virtua Fighter.

Headhunter, average game

No the reviews rated it high.

did you notice something?? man as of that list i mentioned , i was talking about the games they were coming from the 16 bit era like shinobie taht didn' t make it to dreamcast ..

*sigh* If the Dreamcast would' ve been around longer it would' ve had titles such as Shinobi and Panzer Dragoon. But the PS2 had so many 3rd party companies and lots of hype and there were fans who waited for Nintendo' s console so the Dreamcast didn' t last long enough.

by people i mean , not the stupid ***s, i mean hardcore gamers, hell just gamers or critics.... 99% of critics thought devil may cry 1 was excellent, that percentage was not true about shenmue.

Devil May Cry: http://ps2.ign.com/objects/015/015620.aspx
Shenmue: http://dreamcast.ign.com/objects/014/014499.aspx

See the average scores they' ve got? Pretty much the same. Take close look at the press score. An average press score of 9.1 which says it' s an AAA title.
Besides, Shenmue was groundbreaking and something new which is very risky and with such a project you can' t expect everyone to like it. Most people who likes Shenmue are TRUE hardcore gamers. It was the casual gamers who wanted something fast and cool who couldn' t stand it. Devil May Cry was just a stylish action game that was destined to be loved by the casual gamers.

Wouldn' t a place like 1-up.com be better suited to sony fans?

Because this place may not agree with you.

This place would be pretty boring with only a bunch of Sega fans.

No the point of this discussion has become that the Dreamcast is better than the PS2 because the PS2 as hardware is a piece of crap but the software for it is great. Now do you get it?

Ginjirou that was not my point, when you say dreamcast is the best console ever , you don' t talk about the hardware of course , you talk about the console in general, if you had say that dreamcst is a better hardware than ps2, i wouldn' t agree but still i wouldn' t argue that much ...

Never seen DC have better ingame graphics than Onimusha or Tekken tag, 4 or 5.

Never seen DC have better ingame graphics than Onimusha or Tekken tag, 4 or 5.

*sigh*

You want friggin amazing Dreamcast graphics? Ecco the Dolphin.. The only current-generation game that managed to impress me a little after Ecco was Resident Evil 4 for the GameCube, and after that it was Monster Hunter Portable for the PSP.

Never seen DC have better ingame graphics than Onimusha or Tekken tag, 4 or 5.

Cetra please give good exemple cus tekken tag sucks and DOA 2 on dc is much better graphicaly...
so you might mention shadow of the colossus , resident evil 4, god of war or metal gear solid .... but i might know what would ginjirous like say , Dreamcast didn' t have a chance like ps2 and if it lived longer you might see the same graphics or even better... the truth is it didn' t but according to them and if it lived longer it would if it could, i mean they really know that and thus dreamcast is a better hardware than ps2... ps2 is just shit shit shit crap.

You want friggin amazing Dreamcast graphics? Ecco the Dolphin..

teryy i agree with you, ecco was sooo impressive, i loved the graphics and specialy water effects i would love to swim there but the game as a whole didn' t appeal to me , cus at that time i had so many other games on DC ... months later i have seen another jet ski game on the ps2 , which had a beter water effetcs it was more impresive than ecco, i forgot its name now... there was even a sequel ...

In my example which you quoted I mentioned Onimusha. Take Onimusha 3 or 4, no DC game has better graphics, neither does DOA2 than tekken 5

teryy i agree with you, ecco was sooo impressive, i loved the graphics and specialy water effects i would love to swim there but the game as a whole didn' t appeal to me , cus at that time i had so many other games on DC ... months later i have seen another jet ski game on the ps2 , which had a beter water effetcs it was more impresive than ecco, i forgot its name now... there was even a sequel ...

It wasn' t just the water effects of Ecco that impressed me --- I' d imagine that the Jet Ski game focused more on the upper portions of the water --- it was the entire undersea atmosphere of Ecco, I found it totally immersive. It was like watching a Jacques Cousteu BBC broadcast of undersea life.

LOLL people you all suck,Tales of symphonia to GC > ALL.

When I said that games looked better on the Dreamcast I meant that they looked cleaner. Ofc the graphics on the PS2 were better since the Dreamcast was released some time before the PS2. As someone said, it' s like comparing the PS2 graphics with the Xbox graphics which honestly would be pretty stupid.
Anyway, I think Shenmue is a very good example of how nice a DC game could look and you should also look at the textures in Sonic Adventure as well as the smooth framerate in Quake 3 Arena. The DC version of DoA2 looked much cleaner than the PS2 version.
The PS2 didn' t suck, I overexaggerated, but compared to the Dreamcast it wasn' t much better, if any. It was not good enough to be so much more popular than the Dreamcast anyway. What made the PS2 was the hype and software from companies like Square and others who supported the PS1.

Tales of Symphonia for the GC was really good yeah! But I don' t get the problems with the focus in that game!!! Some things got blurred in some scenes which made it look really ugly.

But we can all agree on that ToS was one of the best game this gen,yes?