ORIGINAL: Nitro

Jews, Muslims, Christians.

Kill ' em all.

Muslims cause the most problems out of all of them though, out of any religion by far it has the most fanatics.

Ever hear of the Inquisition? They aren' t even scratching the surface of the machine of brutality that the Christians had running at one point.

Banning all religions? Isn' t that like making one religion your country' s official belief system?

I' m a man of faith yes, but that doesn' t mean I want Christianity to be the " American Religion" . Unification of Church and State is a bad idea, especially in a country as politically, economically, and culturally diverse as the US.

I' m happy living my faith, and I' m more than happy with other people living theirs (or lack of theirs) differently. I might not approve, but I stay out of it. I don' t want other people telling me how to live, and don' t think it' s my place to tell that to anybody else either.

I find it funny that some of you are quick to stereotype Christians as bible-spewing intolerant hate mongers, ignorant of human differences when you yourselves are saying that a certain group of people shouldn' t be able to do what they want with their lives. I don' t care what you have to say about the random groups of uber-conservative idiots that get floated around the internet as " proof" that religion is evil. It' s bullshit, and anybody who believes that that' s the best cross-section of organized religion clearly hasn' t talked to a " normal" religious human being.

I' ll use Christianity as an example. It has screwed up. The church has done some awful things in it' s (relatively) short history, (the inquisition as one shining example) one reason I haven' t considered myself Catholic since primary school, but there' s a difference between being an insane Jew-torturer and a Christian.

A Christian is best described as somebody who follows the teachings of the bible. Give me the chapter and verse where it says that you' re supposed to string Jews and Gypsies up on a rack & rip them apart... I' ll eat every single word.

It' s not religion that' s the problem, it' s human fallibility. Nobody should assume that religious people are any better than atheists. Hell, six in ten Catholic men actively look at porn every single week, the same porn they' re supposed to be shunning.

It' s an unobtainable goal, reaching true religious enlightenment, but my faith has never been about the goal. It' s about the path to a goal. I' m a Christian man because I find that I' m a better human being following the teachings of Jesus. I' ve read the Bible, I' ve read the Qur' an, I' ve read a great deal of the Torah. Hell, I' ve even peeled through the Satanic Bible out of sheer curiosity. I really don' t agree with what' s written in what I' ve read of the Satanic Bible, but I' ve read it, so I can make an educated argument against it. It' s a learning process.

As for the talk of people of faith being more violent? It' s very easy to pin an act of hatred and violence on religion, they' ve got a continuous and fixed motive in their lives to pin it on. Try to do the same with atheism, and let me know how far you get. Atheists do lame stuff too, it' s just that nobody in their right mind would assume that the only reason they did it is because of their faith choices. Not so with religion.

question, how many atheist are in this forum? come on now don' t be shy, who is atheist i need to ask him/her some questions. Nitro you smell atheism...

Dude, almost everybody on Kikizo is an atheist. Only practicing Christians on this forum were me and Rampage, and he' s taken off for a while, so that leaves me as the only person here admitting to being Christian. Nitro' s a Jew, but not Jewish, and I don' t think we have a single Muslim here.

Edit: You Muslim Aba?

Huh...

Muslims cause the most problems out of all of them though, out of any religion by far it has the most fanatics.

you see it the wront way, that' s because muslims are attacked in many parts of the world, Palestine and iraq are the stars of the show... Obviously back fires should be expected.

of course i' m a muslim eddie , i thought you knew that from a long time ago... well still waiting for somebody to answer me, how can they not believe that god exist, but before answering , make sure you read my other post ... thanks.

i' m not sure about this i' m no scholar,

So your not even sure the Religon you are practicing is the right one?

but i' m sure about thing taht islam says, anybody does not believe in god will go to hell FOREVER, he' ll stay in hell and forever...

Great, now tell me this? Does this include Chimps? (don' t laugh anyone reading, im serious) our proven predecessors? Or mentaly disabled people who consciously can' t even think on that level? are They going to burn in hell forever? Would that be fair?


What about small civilizations in parts of the world were religion as we know it (Christianity, Islam) is not even known, Like Eskimos and such? they believe the Moon is a god, are they going to burn in hell? Is that fair when they don' t even know of these rules?

What about the possiblity of Millions of other life forms out there (im sure your aware Man has discovered that this spec ' earth' is tiny part of a galaxy which is formed of Billions of stars, and through Hubble Telescope we' ve recently discovered there are MILLLIONS of galaxies..

Do you believe that our Sun/star out of Trillions is the only one with a habitable planet orbiting it? (our earth)

Do you believe that possible life on other planets are Christians or Muslims? lol

you do know that a lot of scientists believe in GOD

Where? Science is not of the side of GOD these days. The two most vile texts I know of are the Old Testement and the Qu' ran. The scope of the lies and vulgarity are only surpassed by their idiocy.

I don' t even get why we need a GOD to explain the Universe. It' s really quite simple. The Universe always existed in some form. There is no need for a creator. I hear dumb arguments all the time from christians. They keep saying that God must have created everything because how could a Universe create itself? Of couse this doesn' t solve anything, it mearly extends the problem to God. To which they respond God always existed.

You know how I know that existance always existed? Because " nothing" is absalute. You can' t derive anything from absalute nothing (everyone agrees on this basic fact, atheists are the only ones who understand what that means). Nothing would have to be infinit. Which obviously it hasn' t been since we are here. Nothingness is timeless and without boundaries, you either have nothing, or you have something. We exist therefore we' ve always had something. Not even God could add somethign to nothing, it' s a mathematical impossibility.

The idea of God is an attempt to answer where did we come from. It' s a failed and even unnecessary explanation. The best theories about the Universe do not need a creator to work. The leading cosmologists find the idea of GOD offensive.

I could spend all night ripping apart everything the Bible claims to be fact. It would take me 30 minutes to show you how ridiculous and insane the Qu' ran is. In terms of lies, fallocies and expectations from the followers.

After that, all that' s left are emotional appeals. People can' t cope with life so they need hope. I find it deeply depressing that people have to resort to the idea of a heaven where all their problems go away and all their enimies burn in Hell. Isn' t that convenient?

ORIGINAL: Abasoufiane

i' m being serious are u really atheist ?

Technically im Jewish, but i' m not an orthodox Jew and i don' t believe in God.

I' m pretty sure i' ve read bits of the Bible though. It' s the book with Joseph and his technicolour dreamcoat isn' t it?

So your not even sure the Religon you are practicing is the right one?

Well... there' s not much widely accepted proof for any religion, that' s why we also call it faith. I don' t need to know the bible by heart to agree with what I have read.

you mean no exceptions?

i' m not sure about this i' m no scholar, but i' m sure about one thing that THE CORAN says, anybody does not believe in god or believe in GODS will go to hell FOREVER, he' ll stay in hell and forever...

I don' t belive so, but there are many Christians and Muslims who do belive that.

Now directed mostly at VF5 (my brain rants that way).

The Bible itself isn' t a clear sort of rulebook on how to live your life (at least the majority of the bible isn' t). It' s a follow-by-example sort of instruction manual. Apart from the Ten Commandments, there' s not a whole lot of set-in-stone (no pun intended) rules to be followed. The Christian faith is very complicated, but when it' s boiled down the message is rather simple.

" For the whole law can be summed up in this one command: ' Love others as you love yourself.' "
—Galatians 5:14

I can' t speak for the Muslim faith (although I' d be very interested in learning more if Aba' s willing to enlighten), but that seems to be a common theme in the two faiths. We do belive a lot of the same stuff.

What about the possiblity of Millions of other life forms out there (im sure your aware Man has discovered that this spec ' earth' is tiny part of a galaxy which is formed of Billions of stars, and through Hubble Telescope we' ve recently discovered there are MILLLIONS of galaxies..

You don' t have to belive one or the other.

Do you believe that our Sun/star out of Trillions is the only one with a habitable planet orbiting it? (our earth)

Have we found any evidence to support or reject that idea? Not anything conclusive, that much I know.

Do you believe that possible life on other planets are Christians or Muslims? lol

Prove that wrong.

Edit:

I' m pretty sure i' ve read bits of the Bible though. It' s the book with Joseph and his technicolour dreamcoat isn' t it?

Hehehe

There is no one true religion. No religion is any better or any worse than the next, however you get the scum of the earth deciding that they are better than the next person and decide to blow them up, in the name of what a story that may or may not be true, a book that may or may not be fiction. Religion is based on stories that are 1000' s of years old, until you can find me someone who can say they are 100% true and have absolute proof then I will believe. All religions are hypocritical. How can you have a faith that people can interpret as saying kill anyone who doesn' t believe this faith? you can' t it is not religion it is the same ideal that Ghengis Khan, Napolean, Hitler and now al-Qaeda have, that is domination in one form or another, except in the case of al-Queera they try and use religion as their motive. It' s about time the so called defenders of freedom decided once and for all to deal with terrorism, not do it half arsed like they are at the moment, someone needs to make a decision to wipe them out once and for all.

How can you have a faith that people can interpret as saying kill anyone who doesn' t believe this faith? you can' t it is not religion it is the same ideal that Ghengis Khan, Napolean, Hitler and now al-Qaeda have, that is domination in one form or another, except in the case of al-Queera they try and use religion as their motive. It' s about time the so called defenders of freedom decided once and for all to deal with terrorism, not do it half arsed like they are at the moment, someone needs to make a decision to wipe them out once and for all.

So... what... you' re saying that religous people need to be rounded up and wiped out, once and for all?

it is the same ideal that Ghengis Khan, Napolean, Hitler and now al-Qaeda have

Kind of like a... final solution, you would say.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZH7dhSqCoM
Sorry about the music in the video.

You watch that video and you' ll begin to understand why atheists get their head cut off in some of these countries.

heh heh heh.

If you choose to represent a religion you have to speak for all of it. If there is text in your teachings that promote violence against non-believers then you become responsible for these actions.

maan from where should i start , let me start by mister Virtua

So your not even sure the Religon you are practicing is the right one?

i' m not sure that christians will go to hell or heaven even if i believe that their believes are wrong, i' m no scholar to know god will decide with them but at least they are believers, i have no great knowledge about islam as this is an ocean but i know enough to have great faith.

What about small civilizations in parts of the world were religion as we know it (Christianity, Islam) is not even known, Like Eskimos and such? they believe the Moon is a god, are they going to burn in hell? Is that fair when they don' t even know of these rules?

God will deal with those as he should, as he said he will not be infair to anyone. it is understood that for those who do know that god " might" exist will go to hell. as of today, 99.99 of people have heard there " might" be a god.

What about the possiblity of Millions of other life forms out there (im sure your aware Man has discovered that this spec ' earth' is tiny part of a galaxy which is formed of Billions of stars, and through Hubble Telescope we' ve recently discovered there are MILLLIONS of galaxies..

nobody said anything about those, they might exist and they might not and god didn' t say we have created ONLY man.. in fact in the coran he says and i' ll just rephrase , we have created Man and Jin (another creature ) only so they prey. and what he means by that is that this is the main purpose of our creation , to prey him .. WHY ? Only god knows why ..

i think for the other stuff Eddie answered perfectly.


as for Agent

Where? Science is not of the side of GOD these days. The two most vile texts I know of are the Old Testement and the Qu' ran. The scope of the lies and vulgarity are only surpassed by their idiocy.

man what the hell are u saying, the coran is going hand on hand with science most and most of the time , it is truly amazing how things were revealed 1400 years ago and they are just been discovering know ... you can check everywhere on the internet , Coran and science and see how many stuff you will discover :

i' ll list how the universe is expending and everything in the space is moving, how the baby is created, and i mean the steps, how the iron came from space, that the sweet and salt sea don' t mix (only discovered by cousteau) and many many more go and see by yourself... Now some of them are not clear and but they are CLEAR hints , too much for a coincidence , but if god made it soooo clear then obviously the game is over , life is a Test...

I don' t even get why we need a GOD to explain the Universe. It' s really quite simple. The Universe always existed in some form. There is no need for a creator. I hear dumb arguments all the time from christians. They keep saying that God must have created everything because how could a Universe create itself? Of couse this doesn' t solve anything, it mearly extends the problem to God. To which they respond God always existed.

You know how I know that existance always existed? Because " nothing" is absalute. You can' t derive anything from absalute nothing (everyone agrees on this basic fact, atheists are the only ones who understand what that means). Nothing would have to be infinit. Which obviously it hasn' t been since we are here. Nothingness is timeless and without boundaries, you either have nothing, or you have something. We exist therefore we' ve always had something. Not even God could add somethign to nothing, it' s a mathematical impossibility.

i don' t understand your reasoning , basicaly you are ok with the idea that the universe has created itself, that there was nothing before it? how nothing is just created from nothingness, nothing material right? i don' t think your math has proven otherwise, there is always a source of anything in life, but you chose to ignore that and base everything on the allegation that universe was always there ?? think ahead , so we as complicated as we are, how any living being is complicated even the smallest cell is created by mother nature? but that' s what you' re saying here man , that' s exactly what you are saying, we just popped up!

well don' t you even consider that our intelligence might be limited and that we can' t have all the answers , in fact the point of all this is that we should not have all the answers otherwise why all this discution we' re having now ?

I could spend all night ripping apart everything the Bible claims to be fact. It would take me 30 minutes to show you how ridiculous and insane the Qu' ran is. In terms of lies, fallocies and expectations from the followers.

After that, all that' s left are emotional appeals. People can' t cope with life so they need hope. I find it deeply depressing that people have to resort to the idea of a heaven where all their problems go away and all their enimies burn in Hell. Isn' t that convenient?

see this is the kind i' m talking about , arrogance, you think we can' t cope with our lives that' s why we need hope !! you kind is written in the Coran and man if you read the coran you might feel that god is talking about you in many many occasions , he knows what' s in your heart . the difference between the coran and the bible is that in the bible , words are spoken through jesus companions.. in the CORAn it' s God himself who speaks, he says we and We means GOD.. now take a look at the Coran and see what god is saying about you, you might relate to his saying a lot , and believe me God is very very sarcastic...

Gentlemen , this is how i see it:

we are in the classroom and me and Eddie are listening to the teacher , now we might dislike some stuff, and we might not do our homework as we should we damn want to pass...

You agent and your likes are the ones who are sitting behind in the class, making fun of the teacher , telling us our diploma is worth nothing because jobs won' t exist and you can do better the other way around... at the end we all know who gets an F.

i don' t understand your reasoning , basicaly you are ok with the idea that the universe has created itself, that there was nothing before it?

No there was no creation. The Universe always existed, as in no beginning. Otherwise it doesn' t exist. It' s just simple logic. The Univerese is not creatable, it ALWAYS EXISTED. Simply because true absalute nothingness cannot exist before something exists, certainly not alongside " GOD" . Therefore wheather you' re a theist or an atheist you have to accept the fact that existance always existed.

Nothing has no limits, no boundaries and is timeless. God could not exist in nothing. God would have no reference in time to create anything. He would be stuck in nothingness. But nothingness doesnt exist (never has) and neither does a supreme being. The sooner everyone can accept this the better off we' ll be as a human race.

No there was no creation. The Universe always existed, as in no beginning. Otherwise it doesn' t exist. It' s just simple logic. The Univerese is not creatable, it ALWAYS EXISTED. Simply because true absalute nothingness cannot exist before something exists, certainly not alongside " GOD" . Therefore wheather you' re a theist or an atheist you have to accept the fact that existance always existed.

except if we believe in a GOd who has created that beginning , and this is the whole point, even logicaly i don' t believe in smething that has no beginning everything in science has a begining except when it comes to this, atheist suddently said well that' s an exception. and did you read well in my posts that the Coran showed many things that only science discovered lately, out of curiosity you might want to check the internet out.

Islam is a very young religion. Obviously knowledge was more advanced at it' s inception as opposed to Christianity.

Did you watch the video I showed? It seems like the terrorists are the ones who are getting A' s in class. How many disbelivers have you killed Aba?

No there was no creation. The Universe always existed, as in no beginning. Otherwise it doesn' t exist. It' s just simple logic. The Univerese is not creatable, it ALWAYS EXISTED. Simply because true absalute nothingness cannot exist before something exists, certainly not alongside " GOD" . Therefore wheather you' re a theist or an atheist you have to accept the fact that existance always existed.

Nothing has no limits, no boundaries and is timeless. God could not exist in nothing. God would have no reference in time to create anything. He would be stuck in nothingness. But nothingness doesnt exist (never has) and neither does a supreme being. The sooner everyone can accept this the better off we' ll be as a human race.

So you believe in one absolute, but not another? (I' m not BS-ing you dude, honest question)

You believe in eternity, but not void?

[

i' m not sure that christians will go to hell or heaven even if i believe that their believes are wrong, i' m no scholar to know god will decide with them but at least they are believers, i have no great knowledge about islam as this is an ocean but i know enough to have great faith.

So maybe god would give a sly one.. ' you' ve practiced the wrong religion Christian son, but ' ill let you off this time, go through' no?

nobody said anything about those, they might exist and they might not and god didn' t say we have created ONLY man.. in fact in the coran he says and i' ll just rephrase , we have created Man and Jin (another creature ) only so they prey. and what he means by that is that this is the main purpose of our creation , to prey him .. WHY ? Only god knows why ..

Man? what about dinosours, they habitated the earth way before man, why do these rules only aply to MAN? why didn' t these Books explain that MAN was a decent from Ape.

Edidie

You actually believe in adam and Eve?

Agent are u do it in purpose , trying to ignore eveything so you can make a point?? how many times that killing disbelievers are not in ISLAM at all except in War obviously... and man i' m talking about 1400 years old taht not young relatively to what has been discovered today, so now you' re saying that they knew all this way before ?? come on man , if you just try to discover islam a little bit deeper than the bullshit they tell you, you migh discover amazing things, at leaaast it' ll make you have faith, may be not in islam but at least there is a god. sorry i couldn' t watch the video as my brother is downloading soemthing in the network but anyway i think i got the idea.

i' m 100% that you are not 100% that god does not exist.

by the way As our prophete said , most of muslims will go to hell...

" So you believe in one absolute, but not another? (I' m not BS-ing you dude, honest question)

You believe in eternity, but not void?"

I don' t understand your question. You don' t need both. One disproves the other. We' re here, aren' t we? Void is not the same thing as nothing by the way. Not the Nothing that I' m talking about. We have void(s) in space where matter doesn' t exist. We can even create a void or black hole using two really powerful fans in opposing directions to create a vacuume. A void is the absence of something. Nothing is the absence of everything.

You can' t add anything to nothing if you' re not there.