Daytona USA now that' s a game I' d like to see on the next-gen consoles! Much rather than Sega Rally.

It was a joke. My sense of humour is...different. It' s sort of a selfish joke because I' m the only one that gets it. Whenever someone uses a noun I might say they look like that noun. I explained this in another thread after I tried this on Zoy but I can' t find it. It works better in person but I' m still going to do it here because it gets funnier every time without fail. The key is to try in the least appropriate moments and to do it on the same person over and over. For example.

Your boss hands hands you some papers and says: " I need those TPS reports by 4:00pm."

You respond simply with " you look like a TPS report" . With no other explanation.

You boss then says: " Excuse me? Pack your shit and leave, you' re fired."

You say: " you look like shit"

Agent Ghost, why do I allways confuse you with Rampage99? [:' (]

Yeah you look confused.

I am really really Sexy.

......no.

I can see where ginj is coming from. Before stalker, the last game I got was Company of Heroes months ago, and before that...hmm...GTR2 absolutely ages ago!

So yea, lack of games is a serious problem on PC. The difference I find for me is while I buy more console games, I end up selling more than half of them back after the 10 hours playtime they were designed to last for. Whereas all those PC games from months ago are still getting playtime.

Next PC games I' ll purchase are HL2:Ep2, Crysis, Bioshock and Alan Wake and who knows when they' ll be out!

But a long time ago there was a big distinction between PC and console. You had your fun platformers, racers, shooters, fighters, RPGs etc on console, while you got more experimental freeform ideas coming to PC as well as your staple of RTS, FPS (and adventure games a while ago).

Now the line is blurred. Consoles are more like PCs with upgradability, online/internet features etc, and PCs are trying to be consoles with Games for Windows and such... I feel,both wont do either platform any good in the longrun.

In a way, the PS3 is the more console like console over the 360, and I like that. Its just so damn expensive! Anyway, brainfart over.

And Gamer.tv also says that the Wii is the best console.
Hardcore PC gaming is for most people an expensive hobby. I think most of you know what I have said in the past about PC gaming. I do not dispute that the PC is at the forefront of gaming, however the average person on the street is not going to keep paying £100+ every 6 months or so to keep up with the increasing need to be able to play the latest PC game, when they can pay the same price for the software (Having already bought the hardware of course,) and play what is virtually the same game without the added expense of additional memory, video card and sound card.

I know the likes of Evil Man will come back with some kind of insult, however not everyone is at his income level (whatever that maybe but for all the equipment he has it must be good.) I am not moaning about price as it doesn' t bother me either, however like I say it would to the average man on the street.

Most people take a simplistic, incorrect view of PC gaming as an expensive hobby. If a person takes the time to locate the hardware, find the best prices for the hardware they want, and put together their custom rig, they can have a machine that lasts for several years playing all the newest games at the highest resolutions

I' ve been a healthy PC gamer before, and I' ve never been put into the position of upgrading every six months, or a year for that matter. There are huge shifts in technology and hardware every four or five years (the new DX10 shift), but that doesn' t happen all the time.

It' s not about income, it' s about not being stupid.

Also, since stupidity is rampant on the quality of games for the PC vs. the consoles, I' ve decided to put forth some facts into this thread:

Here is the latest metacritic lineup of exclusive games for the PC and their accompanying scores.

PC:
Sam and Max Episode 2: 80%
Silverfall: 62%
C&C 3: 87%
Stalker: 82%
Genesis Rising: 54%
Silent Hunter: 79%
Frontline: 61%
Runaway 2: 71%
Trackmania United: 83%
Battlefield expansion: 76%
The Sacred Rings: 52%
Tortuga Tow Treasures: 47%
Titan Quest expansion: 79%
Sims 2 Seasons: 79%
Sam and Max 4: 81%
MaelStrom: 57%
Supreme Commander: 87%
War Front: Turning Point: 73%
ArmA: Allied Assault: 78%
Galactive Civilizations 2: 91%

Find,
A. Any console that has more exclusive games from this date to Feb 14th (Civ 2 launch)
B. Any console that has more genres (types) of games than the PC lineup
C. Any console that has a higher proportion of good games than the PC lineup

I' ve checked, you can' t, it' s like this all year. The argument of the PC not having sufficient software is put to bed as the sack of lies that it truly is. Fight ignorance with facts, not further ignorance.

ED 1: Cricket 2007 is not PC exclusive.

Are those review scores you have put there? If so they are meaningless in a disscusion about consoles Vs PC' s. A review score is what the reviewer thinks of the game not how many people will buy it or play it.

As for your view on PC gaming not being an expensive hobby, when BF2 came out the specs said that it would run on a FX6200, when the game was purchased, it failed, on speaking to EA they politely informed the user the Specs had changed and this card was no longer supported and the min card was a 6600. The 6200 was a six month old card costing £129.99 at launch, the 6600 was going to be £149.99 anything higher and it would be have been £179 (at that time.) Yes there are places where you can get components on the cheap, but unless you are a hardcore gamer and you know what you are looking for, and if the component is going to be compatible with your MB, CPU or RAM then yes it is not an expensive hobby, but not all hardcore gamers are in to that side of things, it is the same with programmers they know the logic behind programming but not the way to upgrade a machine.

Someone setup a Poll to see what the members on here prefer as their weapon of choice when gaming.

Oh yea I forgot about Sam&Max, SupCom and Trackmania. I got the last one and I' ve been meaning to get the Sam&Max episodes, but I think SupCom will be too in depth for me.

I dont want to get C&C3 either for other reasons...

Are those review scores you have put there? If so they are meaningless in a disscusion about consoles Vs PC' s. A review score is what the reviewer thinks of the game not how many people will buy it or play it.

If we are talking about which platform has the most quality releases, then Metacritic is the best place for it. The PC has more games, a larger amount of better games, and more diverse games than its console counterparts. Sales have nothing to do with quality, an established fact.

As for your view on PC gaming not being an expensive hobby, when BF2 came out the specs said that it would run on a FX6200, when the game was purchased, it failed, on speaking to EA they politely informed the user the Specs had changed and this card was no longer supported and the min card was a 6600. The 6200 was a six month old card costing £129.99 at launch, the 6600 was going to be £149.99 anything higher and it would be have been £179 (at that time.) Yes there are places where you can get components on the cheap, but unless you are a hardcore gamer and you know what you are looking for, and if the component is going to be compatible with your MB, CPU or RAM then yes it is not an expensive hobby, but not all hardcore gamers are in to that side of things, it is the same with programmers they know the logic behind programming but not the way to upgrade a machine.

I' m barely knowledgeable of computers and I can purchase from newegg and put together a box. It' s entry level stuff, really.

Your specific example is one example. For one thing, I don' t play/purchase EA games. For another, that' s a specific card that was dated. If you buy the best stuff for your rig at the time then you will NOT have to update six months from the future. PC development companies do NOT neglect their potential audiences when developing a game. It' s simply incorrect to state that you have to buy a new product every six months. You don' t, you start off big and you make that machine work for four years before upgrading again.

You don' t, you start off big and you make that machine work for four years before upgrading again.

Unless by " make that machine work" you mean upgrade it slowly but constantly over the four years, there is no way it will play games at high graphics settings after two years. The fact is, I can buy a $3,000 computer and if I don' t upgrade it, in 3 years it will struggle to run the newest games, even at low settings. Past that, there is a limit to how much you can upgrade your computer before its just a better idea to start all over again.

I enjoy PC gaming, and I have kept a fairly up to date PC over the last 10 years, but it has always been very expensive and I don' t try and hide that fact.

Console gaming has always been cheaper, even if you buy all the systems of every generation. I have always enjoyed the single player experience on consoles more, but the opposite is true for PC. I loved playing online with the PC, and got high speed internet as soon as it was available. Whether it be Quake, Unreal Tournament, Haflife, or Counterstrike(started playing it in its second beta phase, 0.2 or something). I' ve also played many MMO' s over the years, a bit of UO, a couple months of the realm, and a ton of EQ(before it got shitty with Luclin and all the money hungry expansions).

I would say the main reason I' ve kept upgrading my PC' s was for online gaming, but now that the 360 and even the ps3 are doing great, and in some ways better jobs of online, I am starting to reconsider investing in another rig.

The way I look at it is this. I could buy every console out there right now, buy 5 games for each and I would still be under what I would spend on a high end gaming rig.

I' m also looking forward to a lot more ps3 and 360 games than I am PC regardless of how many " good reviews" PC games get. Oh, and PC' s have never had as good racing games, and thats a big thing for me. With GT5, Forza 2, Motorstorm, and Dirt coming, that doesn' t look to change.

Unless by " make that machine work" you mean upgrade it slowly but constantly over the four years, there is no way it will play games at high graphics settings after two years. The fact is, I can buy a $3,000 computer and if I don' t upgrade it, in 3 years it will struggle to run the newest games, even at low settings. Past that, there is a limit to how much you can upgrade your computer before its just a better idea to start all over again. ]

That' s ridiculous. I got a 4K rig in X-Mas 03 and it was able to easily handle the graphics hogs of 2005 and 2006. My rig can even run Stalker at most high settings. More than that, it was custom bought and not custom built, meaning that I overpaid for everything in the box.

And no, a 3K rig (built properly) would not struggle to run the newest games. Highest settings it may struggle, but a 3k rig WILL last one for more than three years playing the top games at impressive settings. At the moment, it would cost $700 to buy a ViciousPC that would run Oblivion on developer reccomended settings.

I enjoy PC gaming, and I have kept a fairly up to date PC over the last 10 years, but it has always been very expensive and I don' t try and hide that fact. ]

I' ve been a PC gamer my whole life, and it has barely been a burden to update my computer. There has never been a need to consistently update. The only wildcard is if you fail on the Ram portion of the deal and it clogs your whole system, that' s a problem, but that' s because the person was ignorant in the first place.

Console gaming has always been cheaper, even if you buy all the systems of every generation. I have always enjoyed the single player experience on consoles more, but the opposite is true for PC. I loved playing online with the PC, and got high speed internet as soon as it was available. Whether it be Quake, Unreal Tournament, Haflife, or Counterstrike(started playing it in its second beta phase, 0.2 or something). I' ve also played many MMO' s over the years, a bit of UO, a couple months of the realm, and a ton of EQ(before it got shitty with Luclin and all the money hungry expansions).

Console gaming being cheaper is not the case. With a high end PC I get something that can run hundreds of applications with the utmost efficiency. While consoles are moving closer to media centers, they don' t come close to comparing to PCs. If I were to evaluate the sum total useage I got out of my computer besides gaming, it would easily devalue my consoles.

Furthermore, I' ve found that the sheer volume of games and the amount of developers working for the PC create a more creative and productive environment. Your lack of playing good single player PC games is because your time has been utterly sucked up by good multiplayer games. I, too, played EQ in addition to some others (most notably Daoc) and those were timesinks as well. Still, I can' t honestly say that the PC has a deficiency when compared to consoles, it doesn' t.

I would say the main reason I' ve kept upgrading my PC' s was for online gaming, but now that the 360 and even the ps3 are doing great, and in some ways better jobs of online, I am starting to reconsider investing in another rig.

The reason why I bought an expensive PC to last for a long time (read: not constantly upgrading) is because PC' s are the new lifeline of civilization. The games I got to play on my machine were simply a bonus. XBL is a tremendous system, but it doesn' t offer modding, nor the community needed to sustain itself as a superior element to PC gaming. Things are simply better in the PC world, and this is coming from a Sega fanboy.

The way I look at it is this. I could buy every console out there right now, buy 5 games for each and I would still be under what I would spend on a high end gaming rig.

Yeah, and these things also have crappy cinema players. The computer is a gateway to a larger world than video games, and the potential for a video game on a computer is far higher than it is on consoles. Modding has proven to be better than anybody imagined, and that' s still not possible on any console. Even with Epic' s comments about PS3 modding (which requires a computer) and XBL' s new dev kit (they charge for everything, don' t they?), it' s completely different than the freedom the PC allows.

I' m also looking forward to a lot more ps3 and 360 games than I am PC regardless of how many " good reviews" PC games get. Oh, and PC' s have never had as good racing games, and thats a big thing for me. With GT5, Forza 2, Motorstorm, and Dirt coming, that doesn' t look to change.

Your taste doesn' t hold precedence in an objective argument. PC games will have the highest number of well reviewed games this year and the next. The platform will also have the largest array of genres in comparison to other consoles.

It simply offers more, period.

My friend bought a top spec SLI computer with 3GB of ram, two 6600GT' s, and a 3.2ghz processor about 3 years ago. Today it cannot run the top of the line games at high settings without extremely noticeable slowdown.

Console gaming being cheaper is not the case. With a high end PC I get something that can run hundreds of applications with the utmost efficiency. While consoles are moving closer to media centers, they don' t come close to comparing to PCs. If I were to evaluate the sum total useage I got out of my computer besides gaming, it would easily devalue my consoles.

You mention this, and mention the same idea again a couple times in the post, and you are right, but you forget one key thing. A properly pieced together $700 computer can run almost any of the applications you are talking about. So yes, computers can do much more than consoles, but you don' t need a high end gaming rig to do the vast majority of what computers can offer. Therefore, IMO, you are better off buying consoles for games, and keeping an efficient but cheap computer for everything else they can' t do.

I love PC' s, but by no means do you need anything more than a basic rig to take advantage of everything besides gaming. Unless you are an engineer or designer, and then its part of your business, not a convenience.

Your taste doesn' t hold precedence in an objective argument. PC games will have the highest number of well reviewed games this year and the next. The platform will also have the largest array of genres in comparison to other consoles.

Did I say they did? I said racing games are a big thing for me, so that pushes me towards consoles. I also believe you are too quickly giving PC' s the edge for genre offerings.

PC' s are often lacking in " adventure" games to consoles. Now we can counter that saying PC' s have RTS games in spades, and consoles have few, if any. So they cancel eachother out.

Consoles have turn based RPG' s like FF etc, whereas the PC has next to none. PC' s have MMO' s to counter that, so they cancel eachother out again.

Consoles are generally much more enjoyable for sports games, and have a larger of such titles.
Consoles have a much much larger selection of racing games.
Consoles now have many of the PC' s FPS games(PC has a few exclusives as well), and a few of their own, so I would say, other than not having a mouse and keyboard(soon to change), they are on even footing(yes some ports end up bad, I admit it).
PC' s were late to get huge blockbuster games like GTA, and the whole Tony Hawk series.
Both the consoles and PC' s both have widely loved classic titles, but I would give the edge to the consoles thanks to so many differing design approaches among the brands, and the sheer amount of titles.
I could keep adding, but I will leave the rest to others.

Feel free to add to the list, and post what you think good comparisons are, but I think you are dead wrong claiming the PC has a larger array of genre' s.

Lots of games with DECENT scores on that list but nothing I' m interested in really.
Sims 2 Seasons, I mean c' mon!!!!!

Billy you sound like someone else on here but I can' t quite think who.

I would love to see your specs of the machine you bought in 2003 which is still currently running top end games at full spec today. 2003 would have seen the early P4 and Athlon 64 cpu' s and the GPU would be something like a 5700 or an Ati 9200 I think, now if that is the case either the specs written on the back are incorrect or you had technology that was not freely available to the general public back then.

You mentioned you are able to play Stalker with settings on high on your 2003 rig.

MINIMUM SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS:
Microsoft® Windows® XP (Service Pack 2) / Microsoft® Windows® 2000 SP4
Processor type : Intel Pentium 4 2.0 Ghz / AMD XP 2200+
512 MB RAM
10 GB available hard drive space
128 MB DirectX® 8.0 compatible card / nVIDIA® GeForce™ 5700 / ATI Radeon® 9600
DirectX® 9.0 compatible sound card
LAN/Internet connection with low latency Cable/DSL speeds for multiplayer
Keyboard, Mouse

RECOMMENDED SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS:
Microsoft® Windows® XP (Service Pack 2) / Microsoft® Windows® 2000 SP4
Processor type : Intel Core 2 Duo E6400 / AMD 64 X2 4200+
1.5 GB RAM
10 GB available hard drive space
256 MB DirectX® 9.0c compatible card / nVIDIA® GeForce™ 7900 / ATI Radeon® X1950
DirectX® 9.0 compatible sound card
LAN/Internet connection with low latency Cable/DSL/T1+ speeds for multiplayer
Keyboard, Mouse

HIGH SYSTEM REQUIREMENTS:
Microsoft® Windows® XP (Service Pack 2) / Microsoft® Windows® 2000 SP4
Processor type : Intel Core2 Duo E6700 / AMD 64 X2 5200+
2 GB RAM
10 GB available hard drive space
512 MB DirectX® 9.0c compatible card / nVIDIA® GeForce™ 8800 / ATI Radeon® X2800
DirectX® 9.0 compatible sound card
LAN/Internet connection with low latency Cable/DSL/T1+ speeds for multiplayer
Keyboard, Mouse

Unless you have upgraded then I find it hard to believe.

Sales would come into the equation, if a PC game only sells what say 100,000 copies and a console sells double or triple that amount, doesn' t that show the swing toward console gaming? Take out of the equation expansions as you are counting the game twice,as you already need the original to play the expansion.

My friend bought a top spec SLI computer with 3GB of ram, two 6600GT' s, and a 3.2ghz processor about 3 years ago. Today it cannot run the top of the line games at high settings without extremely noticeable slowdown. .

Why your friend bought 3 gigs of ram is beyond my comprehension, but his rig is far more than competent to handle top tier games. Furthermore, just because he can' t run at highest settings doesn' t mean he can' t run at normal settings or above normal settings. Every game released today looks excellent on his PC and it plays well on his PC. His computer is not struggling to play Stalker or Oblivion, and you know this as fact.

quote:

Console gaming being cheaper is not the case. With a high end PC I get something that can run hundreds of applications with the utmost efficiency. While consoles are moving closer to media centers, they don' t come close to comparing to PCs. If I were to evaluate the sum total useage I got out of my computer besides gaming, it would easily devalue my consoles.

You mention this, and mention the same idea again a couple times in the post, and you are right, but you forget one key thing. A properly pieced together $700 computer can run almost any of the applications you are talking about. So yes, computers can do much more than consoles, but you don' t need a high end gaming rig to do the vast majority of what computers can offer. Therefore, IMO, you are better off buying consoles for games, and keeping an efficient but cheap computer for everything else they can' t do. .

Computers as a server? As a graphics art program? Multitasking with Powerpoint animations? Clear DVD playback? DVD burning? There are plenty of programs that need high end processing speed, high ram, good video cards and sound cards. Games are the clearest explanation as to why high end stuffing is needed, but they are far from the sole reason.

I love PC' s, but by no means do you need anything more than a basic rig to take advantage of everything besides gaming. Unless you are an engineer or designer, and then its part of your business, not a convenience. .

Well, again, I beg to differ. As a college student I run into many reasons why I would need a high end computer. The above reasons still apply. If I want to download music, create a flash animation, attach it to a powerpoint, and act as a game host server, I' m going to need some serious muscle.

Did I say they did? I said racing games are a big thing for me, so that pushes me towards consoles. I also believe you are too quickly giving PC' s the edge for genre offerings. .

Well, racing games have had a pretty strong presence on PCs for a long time. Trackmania was recently released and Sega Rally Revo is coming out. Most racing games should be released for the PC, games like Colin Mcrae, NFS, and others fit the bill as well.

PC' s are often lacking in " adventure" games to consoles. Now we can counter that saying PC' s have RTS games in spades, and consoles have few, if any. So they cancel eachother out. .

These are generalizations that don' t fully embrace the point I' m trying to make. Certain genres are assumed for certain platforms, and you' ll find a majority of one genre not sharing spaces. But it' s impossible to deny that PC games have the greatest expanse over the gaming world. Just go to Metacritic and look at the different games that are released and compare them to the console offerings. And I just don' t mean genres, I mean original games and completely different gametypes. It' s a free world on the PC side, whereas the console world has expectations that need to be met.

Consoles have turn based RPG' s like FF etc, whereas the PC has next to none. PC' s have MMO' s to counter that, so they cancel eachother out again.

Consoles are generally much more enjoyable for sports games, and have a larger of such titles.
Consoles have a much much larger selection of racing games.
Consoles now have many of the PC' s FPS games(PC has a few exclusives as well), and a few of their own, so I would say, other than not having a mouse and keyboard(soon to change), they are on even footing(yes some ports end up bad, I admit it).
PC' s were late to get huge blockbuster games like GTA, and the whole Tony Hawk series.
Both the consoles and PC' s both have widely loved classic titles, but I would give the edge to the consoles thanks to so many differing design approaches among the brands, and the sheer amount of titles.
I could keep adding, but I will leave the rest to others.

Feel free to add to the list, and post what you think good comparisons are, but I think you are dead wrong claiming the PC has a larger array of genre' s.

Look, buddy, you' re simply making generalizations, and it' s not that I don' t agree with some of it. It' s that your assumptions are getting in the way of factual evidence. Please go to metacritic and look at the assortment of titles. See if they are franchises/licenses/knockoffs and you' ll have the answer.

It' s a fact that the PC gaming market embraces more unique ideas due to its open nature for development. You can say that the PC doesn' t have a game like FFX, and while it' s not really true, what really makes it irrelevant is the fact that FFX is a dime a dozen game on the consoles, whereas a game like take Command: Second Manassas is a game that is unlike any other save for Sid Meier' s Civil War series and that' s anywhere including the PC.

A game like Trackmania is unlike anything else, yet Dirt is just another in a long line of offroad racing titles. They are different, stand on their own feet, but they aren' t intellectually different in a way that Trackmania is.

So don' t get down to petty and simplistic generalizations. Analyze the different market structures and come to a logical conclusion. Development for the PC, in nature, is open book, whereas for the consoles it' s a much more confined arena where established ways of going about business take precedent over wildly creative ideas. In fact, the wildly creative ideas coming out of the console world are typically things that originate in the PC market or they come from previously established developers who made their publishers so rich that they don' t have to answer to the man. In the PC market, meanwhile, any joe and lucy can conjure up a game and release it with success dependant on a number of factors exclusive to the PC. How could the Ship do so well? That' s not another multiplayer game, that' s a completely inventive title.

And yes, things are changing. The Wii' s development kit cost and Xbox' s download service as well DX format are allowing for smaller developers to get their piece without selling out to the big boys. Even the Playstation is allowing for creative ideas to come over the pipeline. But it' s impossible to argue that what the consoles have right now is near the same level of freedom of creativity that the PC has.

ORIGINAL: Dagashi

My friend bought a top spec SLI computer with 3GB of ram, two 6600GT' s, and a 3.2ghz processor about 3 years ago. Today it cannot run the top of the line games at high settings without extremely noticeable slowdown.

That' s his problem. 6600GT' s were the Mid-Low range of cards back when they were released. If you' re going to do SLI, you never ever use two budget cards, because they simply don' t last. SLI is only something you do when you have money to burn on the best of the best. If he had bought two 6800 Ultra' s in SLI, he' d be faring much much better today. Heck, he would have been much better off doing a single 6800GT than two 6600GT' s.

My 04 system, which has an Athlon 64 3000+, 1.5GB RAM and a single 6800GT can still run nearly all games at high settings and decent framerates. If your friend upgraded his graphics card now to something mid ranged, he' d be able to keep that PC for another year+ no problems.

Believe me when I say this. If you' re smart and buy the right components at the right prices, you' ll be able to keep your PC running well for 2-3 years no problems. If you don' t put a bit of thought into your PC, it won' t last half that time.