Gabe Newell calls PS3 a " disaster"

According to a GAF poster the most recent issue of GameInformer contains an interview with Newell and when asked what he thought about PS3 his reply was...

The PS3 is a total disaster on so many levels, I think It' s really clear that Sony lost track of what customers and what developers wanted. I' d say, even at this late date, they should just cancel it and do a " do over" . Just say, " This was a horrible disaster and we' re sorry and we' re going to stop selling this and stop trying to convince people to develop for it" . The happy story is the Wii. I' m betting that by Christmas of next year, the Wii has a larger installed base than the 360. Other people think I' m crazy. I really like everything that Nintendo is doing. "

Now i don' t have the magazine as the UK issue isn' t out yet so if somebody here has it i' d appreciate confirmation that this is genuine.

The GAF thread is kinda out of control but can be found HERE

Who is this Gabe guy? Is he important? Is he smart?

He sounds like an idiot. Yeah, PS3 has quite a few flaws, but it' s not a total disaster.

I think when you look at the entire spectrum; production, forward panning, an online network, failure to deliver at launch, losing key exclusives etc... so far PS3 has been a disaster.

Bear in mind that Kutaragi was sidelined for how the console was handled prior to launch.

Dev support is going to be key for PS3s next 10 years (heh) and Gabe' s comments have been all too common so far amongst a lot of them.

Gabe' s always been a PC guy though with HL2, and he' s gone on record before to say asymmetric multi-threading is too mindboggling for him! So he' s not gonna be the first guy to jump to PS3.

Just cos he can' t hack it though, doesn' t mean other devs wont be able to! A lot of Japanese devs are probably cleverer than him hehe.

ORIGINAL: choupolo

Dev support is going to be key for PS3s next 10 years (heh) and Gabe' s comments have been all too common so far amongst a lot of them.

Gabe' s always been a PC guy though with HL2, and he' s gone on record before to say asymmetric multi-threading is too mindboggling for him! So he' s not gonna be the first guy to jump to PS3.

Just cos he can' t hack it though, doesn' t mean other devs wont be able to! A lot of Japanese devs are probably cleverer than him hehe.

Yeah but Carmack and Newell are two of the most revered people in the industry, both with big titles in development for the consoles. Whether it' s a case of him thinking it' s too complex or not isn' t the issue, the issue is that others will look, listen and read into it.

That' s true.

Remember what he said earlier in October 2005 too:

" There are incredibly few programmers who can safely write code in the PlayStation 3 environment. And I totally see why Sony wants people to write code that runs on seven SPEs and a central processing unit, because that code is never going to run well anywhere else. They' re saying, " Make your code not run on anything but one of our machines, and we' re betting that we' ll have market share that' s so high that everybody will have to write for our platform. We' ll just starve the air from the other platforms by absorbing everybody' d R&D budget and making their code less portable."

Sounds reasonable but a little like sour grapes too! He' s never really been hot for PS3...

link

Calling the PS3 a disaster! Oh come on what a load of bull!

Calling the PS3 a disaster! Oh come on what a load of bull!

Sarcasm?

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

ORIGINAL: choupolo

That' s true.

Remember what he said earlier in October 2005 too:

" There are incredibly few programmers who can safely write code in the PlayStation 3 environment. And I totally see why Sony wants people to write code that runs on seven SPEs and a central processing unit, because that code is never going to run well anywhere else. They' re saying, " Make your code not run on anything but one of our machines, and we' re betting that we' ll have market share that' s so high that everybody will have to write for our platform. We' ll just starve the air from the other platforms by absorbing everybody' d R&D budget and making their code less portable."

Sounds reasonable but a little like sour grapes too! He' s never really been hot for PS3...

link

Well that' s work the other way too which is why many games are being developed primarily on 360 and then ported to PS3 rather than the the way around. In the long run that doesn' t benefit Sony.

These recent comments come after the launches. Sony' s launch was a complete fuck up. Technologically they' ve made choices that are still questionable, ...it' ll be a while until it' ll be clear or not if they' ve paid off. I mean, every other developer has been praising Microsoft and their development tools, while saying that PS3 is harder to work for etc. Ok, so that was the case with PS2 too but Xbox wasn' t a real threat to Sony last time, and right now Sony are playing catch up with an opponent that has more money, resources, currently developer support, AND has already passed 10M sold.

Kutaragi screwed up. They didn' t plan ahead and made some really funky decisions. I mean, they originally wanted to use multiple CELL processors rather than have a GPU. Obviously that would have saved them a lot of money but it didn' t work and they had to run to NVIDIA and get what the could afford. That happened to be an inferior GPU to what Microsoft have. Then the messed up the RAM allocation, something many developers have already complained about.

They weren' t originally going to have an online network. Then when the re-modeled Xbox Live received so much praise they decided that they needed one. What they' ve ended up with is a jumbled mess that will no doubt improve over time but still, we' re talking about how they' ve handled it so far and not how it might be in 2 years time.

What Gabe is saying is that Nintendo are applying the same business model to Wii as they have done to DS. I too have said that i expect Wii to take the marketplace lead towards the end of Q4 2007. But right now you have Nintendo and Sony trailing Microsoft, and Nintendo who launched after Sony and have sold 4x the number of consoles.

Supply and demand looks to have already equalized and there are many reports of PS3' s being available but stil not selling. Just ask Mass, he mentioned it the other day regarding the store he works at.

Is his comment about it being a disaster OTT? Possibly, and the guy is almost certainly biased, but he' s also an important industry figure and knows more than we do. I don' t know about you but i wouldn' t second guess the guy behind the Half Life games and STEAM platform.

Sarcasm?

No way! Why would I call the PS3 a disaster?

No way! Why would I call the PS3 a disaster?

No clue

Your avatar still scares me to this day, I would hate to come upon that in a dark alley

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Your avatar still scares me to this day, I would hate to come upon that in a dark alley

LOL.

Miyamoto is scary? Wow.... just wow....

Reggie scares me........

yes, in that picture he is terrifying

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Reggie Fils-Aime is my idol!

Reggie will be just as popular as Chuck Norris very soon. Wait till you see.....

Newell its just amazing and i belive hes rigth in something he said but lets not forget his roots, he worked +10 years in Microsoft and he made his fortune there and he is very well known for the good relatioships he has with some MS execs, now that being said i belive the last NPD report and the Media Create numbers show very clear that the PS3 may no be doing as good as the industry leader should but its not doing bad at all.

Reggie will be just as popular as Chuck Norris very soon. Wait till you see.....

No one can be as popular chuck norris

From the track record of SOny PS1, 2.. PS3 is a disaster..

Though this is more due to the amount of time taking to make the things..

Theres no doubting that Ps3 will atleast come in second place this generation.

The hardware has alot of potential (Seeing motorstorm in realtime slapped me round the face, does shit i havent seen in consoles games before apparently only uses 40% of it ' average' potential).

Linux / open sourced for PS network is a major plus too, it really is the first true multi-media console (not locked & limited shit like Live)..

Once the Ps3 is freely availible. its gonna take off again, Just like the Wii.

The hardware has alot of potential (Seeing motorstorm in realtime slapped me round the face, does shit i havent seen in consoles games before apparently only uses 40% of it ' average' potential).

Motorstorm? A slap in the face? yeah maybe to sony fans

Once the Ps3 is freely availible. its gonna take off again, Just like the Wii.

Ummm, actually at my local target they have had so many ps3s not selling that over the past 2 weeks they have built up a collection of 12 and no one is buying them, unlike the wii which is still pretty hard to find

Motorstorm? A slap in the face? yeah maybe to sony fans

Actually, i hated Sony (still do). never owned one of their cosoles, PS3 will be a first for me. Even after being used to crazyly smooth/detailed PC Games, i find MS really impressive visually.

At least they weren' t stupid enough to stick with their original plan to use CELL as the GPU and the boomerang controller.
Sony went with a bunch of extremely risky strategies that could either pay out big or bomb. So far they haven' t been doing so well.

"If you knew how good I am you would think I'm modest."

Actually, i hated Sony (still do). never owned one of their cosoles, PS3 will be a first for me. Even after being used to crazyly smooth/detailed PC Games, i find MS really impressive visually.

I was just pointing this out. Youre responding as if i said " sony fanboys" i said fans not fan boys. Just to make it clear

This guy at work bought a PS3 to resell, and couldn' t get rid of the damn thing! He was even going so far as to throw in an extra controller and sell it at retail and STILL couldn' t sell it!!

Once the Ps3 is freely availible. its gonna take off again

That day has been here for a few weeks now, but whatever helps you sleep at night....

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

I' ve got a friend attempting to sell me his 60 gig, for almost 100 BELoW retail, if that has any bearing. He said he wanted a PSP & a 360.

The way Sony has handled PS3 as an entity has been a disaster, but the hardware itself is not. I assumed that is what he was reffering to BTW. Just a clarification.

I' m not on expert on what was going on when the 360 released, but in Canada it was easy to find just 1 month after release. So, I don' t really think you can point out the fact that they aren' t impossible to find as a reason it won' t do well.

The wii seems to be the hardest console to find after launch than any I have seen in the past. Comparing any console to it is sorta setting it up to look bad.

At least they weren' t stupid enough to stick with their original plan to use CELL as the GPU and the boomerang controller.
Sony went with a bunch of extremely risky strategies that could either pay out big or bomb. So far they haven' t been doing so well.

I agree with that, they have made a lot of fumbles, and taken some big risks, it' s to early to tell how its gonna play out though. I really think that after the next release of games + europes release we will really get an idea of where it' s headed.

edit to add statements below:

This guy at work bought a PS3 to resell, and couldn' t get rid of the damn thing! He was even going so far as to throw in an extra controller and sell it at retail and STILL couldn' t sell it!!

You have to remember that buying things off people, off ebay in particular, is not nearly as prefferable as buying it yourself in store. That way you are gaurenteed it is perfect in box, and can buy whatever warantee' s for it that you want. If there are ps3' s widely available as the Americans on this board say there are, then those are gonna get bought up before the ones on Ebay. So far in Calgary, one of the biggest cities in Canada, no retail stores have ps3' s. Maybe Canadians buy more, or maybe we get less per capita, I have no idea.

This is not to say the demand is high, it obviously isnt as high as Sony would have hoped, but it is to say that such examples don' t write the thing off as not being desired.

they always have a PS3 at wal-mart here, I don' t see Wii' s very often though.

"If you knew how good I am you would think I'm modest."

hey always have a PS3 at wal-mart here, I don' t see Wii' s very often though.

where do you live? And as far as the wii goes, thats my point exactly. The thing sells like hotcakes, even though they have shipped a huge amount so far. Compare any recent console to it and they all would look like they did poor. I would like to know the Xbox360' s sales within the first 3 months. Anyone have a credible source of info on that? I never really payed attention to console sales until recently.

You have to keep in mind though that a lot of it is based on price too. Many people will pick up a Wii just because it' s cheap. PS3, they may think twice or wait a few years. That - and there are many more casual gamers than hardcore techies out there...

Here' s how we do it at the Target I work at. We put out a select few to see how quickly they sell. Then we either add more space for quicker sales or we keep the current space and backstock the rest. For the Wii. We have not backstocked and none on the floor. Its currently non existant at this point as no new ones have come in.

The 360s situation is during the holidays it had lotsa of space. Not just in its normal electronics section but an entire back wall with about 30 or so of the damn things. Nows it back ti its normal space and about 10-12 backstocked on average.

The PS3 has kept its space since its initial release and the backstock has slowly been building. We been selling maybe about 1 per week and have a total stock of 12 (of the 12 we keep 3-4 on display). HQ has slowed its supply or its just not getting anymore at the moment either like the Wiis.

Saw this in the news. I don' t blame him. Sony should have canceled and start over still incoperating the blu ray tech since that was one of their mission. However, i wouldn' t give up on Sony PS3 just yet, if any one can make a comeback they can.
Don' t quote me on that.

You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.

I was at my friends house this weekend playing the ps3. He has all the game consoles ever release including the atari lynx. jaguar & game gear. I was actually quite underwhelmed, the controler was just too light, the games seem to missing something without the rumble feature & i think resistance & motor storm could have really benefited from it. A driving game without rumble just feels lame & not feeling the kick of your gun just sux. I really can' t see the big deal that F3 hunter keeps making about motorstorm, that game didn' t impress me at all, & i thought alot of the ground textures were pathetic. I mean if he' s really really gonna hate on 360 like he always does then hate on that system too, because it honestly sux balls at the moment, and even $400 seems like too much. Didn' t get to try the wii yet though, I was gonna have him hook it up, but I was too tired it being 3am in the morning and all & couln' t see myself doing the wii movements when I could barely keep my eyes open. I' ll check it soon though

I was actually quite underwhelmed, the controler was just too light, the games seem to missing something without the rumble feature & i think resistance & motor storm could have really benefited from it. A driving game without rumble just feels lame & not feeling the kick of your gun just sux. I really can' t see the big deal that F3 hunter keeps making about motorstorm, that game didn' t impress me at all, & i thought alot of the ground textures were pathetic

Yet again, someone is judging a game by its downloadable demo, a demo of a game not completed.

The controller is too light? I can' t understand that being a downside, thats one of the best things about the wii/ps3 controllers. The xbox controllers being as heavy as they are seem like more of a downside to me than an upside, and has always been a criticized part of the controller.

As far as rumble goes, yah, some people miss it. I don' t really care, and never really got kicks from having rumble features in my controller. I only really care about force feedback on steering wheels.

Tell me why the ps3 " sux balls at the moment" other than the price. The xbox360 had no better games 3 months into its launch, and heck, the wii has only two good ones, Zelda and Wii sports.

I' m fine with you disliking it, but you have to keep certain things in mind when you are talking about competing consoles.

The controller is too light? I can' t understand that being a downside, thats one of the best things about the wii/ps3 controllers. The xbox controllers being as heavy as they are seem like more of a downside to me than an upside, and has always been a criticized part of the controller.

Imo the old XBox controller was huge and clunky, but the 360s one has lost weight and to me feels just right.

Although I' m also fine with the smaller lighter playstation controllers. Actually both the dualshock and sixaxis felt the same weight to me. I think people overestimate the difference for some reason, due to the lack of rumble maybe.

As far as rumble goes, yah, some people miss it. I don' t really care, and never really got kicks from having rumble features in my controller. I only really care about force feedback on steering wheels.

FFB which of course you can' t get on PS3 either.

https://forum.kikizo.com/tm.asp?m=89438&p=5&tmode=1&smode=1

I definitely miss rumble too.

FFB which of course you can' t get on PS3 either.

Yah, thats a shame for sure. IMO steering wheels are useless without good force feedback, it makes drifting and handling oversteer and counter steering much easier.

This would be easy to implement into the firmware of course, and I hope Sony listens to people like Polyphony and implements it.

I' ve also heard rumors that the Japanese release of the GT HD demo supports the Force Feedback on steering wheels.