Some comments from Sony.

Hirai first made comments about the system' s use of the Blu-ray format. As reason for SCE' s choice, he pointed to the availability of 50 gigabytes space on a two layer disk and also made note of high transfer rate. " Blu-ray' s high transfer rate and large space can recreate creator' s visions as they are," said Hirai.

Sony does expect game developers to use the format. Referring to the PlayStation 2, Hirai commented: " During the first year, CD-ROM was used 74% of the time while DVD-ROM was used 26%. However, five years later, CD-ROM was at 5% while DVD-ROM had become 95%." Sony expects a similar expansion for the use of BD-ROM in games.

Kutaragi let slip one bit about the PS3' s next generationness (it' s a word -- look it up!). According to Kutaragi, Sony is hoping to make the PlayStation 3 compatible with the next generation of HDMI output (HDMI is a type of connection that will likely be required for viewing movies in high definition). The current generation of HDMI offers 8-bit levels for each color channel. The next generation of HDMI will offer 16-bit levels. " It' s meaningless to process at 16 bit internally and then output at 8 bit," Kutaragi commented. " We' d like to have sixteen bit, or at the very least, 12 bit."

-IGN.com-

Another thing is that Tecmo President said that he praises Rev for interface , 360 for Online support and PS3 for power.Yu Suzuki also believes PS3 to have significant performance advantage over 360.

Why? I mean Sony said so - yes , but those specs (especially GPU) aren' t that impressive - comparing to 360.
Shit maybe I' m just wrong and the Cell alone gives incredible performance.
It is after all a CPU newer generation than G5 based 360 CPU.
It' s interesting - but pure speculation ...I can' t wait for some presentations :)

Sony' s own performance figures rate Cell at 218 gigaflops, with Microsofts data showing that 360' c CPU rated at around 115 gigflops. Sound' s bad for Microsoft doesn' t it? Well, it' s not quite that clear cut...

Sony have been very underhand so far with how they' ve come up with their figures, because Sony' s data (218 gigaflops), isn' t just based on the Cell CPU. It transpired after TGS that they had also included the performance of their grphics chipset too. Sneaky eh?!

Developers seem to agree that Sony' s clock speed is slightly higher, but only slightly. But they also agree that in terms of total bandwidth and shader power then 360 comes out ahead, though only slightly.

THE biggest key factor, since the CPU' s are pretty much on par, will be the memory available and how it' s allocated...

They both have 512Mb of DDR3 RAM, but it' s structured in different ways...

Sony, with PS3 decided to split it into 2, with 256Mb for Cell and 256Mb for the RSX graphics chip, although the RSX can render the entire 512Mb if it' s required although that would put a significant strain on Cell.

Microsoft on the other hand have shared the entire 512Mb between the CPU and the GPU and it can divided as the developer see' s fit or requires. In addition, Microsoft added and extra 10Mb of very, very fast EDRAM (which is expensive) to 360' s GPU, and this gives 360 an advantage as far as rendering goes. How much of an advantage isn' t know yet, but it means that the differences between the graphical output of the ealier titles on both consoles will be more noticable than further down the line.

Both consoles use multi-core, multi-threaded CPU' s, but developers have pointed out that in terms of data transfer per cycle to the CPU, 360' s has 6 times the bandwidth of PS3. It simply means that 360 can do the calculations required for rendering faster, it doesn' t mean there will be a performance advantage unless developers can really get to grips with it.

Claims that PS3 will suffer from antialiasing problems in it' s 1st generation of titles look to be true. Now because Microsoft decided to forgo the added cost of placing 10Mb of EDRAM on the graphics chip to deal with problems like antialiasing, z-testing and alpha blending, so it didn' t put an additional load on the chipset, early indications show that 360' s games will look clearer and crisper for probably the 1st year of PS3' s life after release.

See Sony has decided, as was the case with PS2, to let the developer figure out how to combat the issue, using middleware an such. It just means that until developers come up with techniques to resolve such things that 360' s games will look cleaner. 360 has been praised for being so developer friendly, but as we saw with PS2, and as Yu Suzuki said, the PS3 will take time for developers to get to grips with but because of it' s architecture, it means that it' s graphics will improve vastly over the course of it' s life.

I would go on, but there really isn' t any need. Both consoles are powerful, that' s a given. They' re both better at different things, but until developers get to grips with both systems (which takes more than a year after the console is on release), the advantages in terms of processing power and graphics for one or the other are indeterminable.

I wouldn' t expect anything even near the video' s Sony displayed at E3 or TGS within the next 4/5 years. It' s just not possible to do that yet. Unfortunately.

Role on Revolution (N5)!!!

Sony have been very underhand so far with how they' ve come up with their figures, because Sony' s data (218 gigaflops), isn' t just based on the Cell CPU. It transpired after TGS that they had also included the performance of their grphics chipset too. Sneaky eh?!

Yeah I know - I' m not saying I can see PS3 power with specs - quite the opposite - I just wonder why almost any developer thinks it' s much more powerful.

Some developers, like Kojima have had dev-kits (though unfinished) for quite a while and haven' t actually had hands on with 360.

It' s all going to depend on what developers can do with the systems. I mean Kojima said that from what he HAD seen of 360, that MGS4 (in regards to the demonstration at TGS) was definately possible. So while i' m sure PS3 will have a slight performance advantage, i can' t see it being realised within the next couple of years.

Sony' s incredibly good at generating hype, and they have to use the same kind of method to woo developers over because they know they need exclusive titles.

Information shows that 360 launch games show only 18% of it' s graphical capacity that' s available NOW. That means that it' s only using just under a 5th of what it can do at the moment with techniques, renders, shaders etc that are already available. When games developers and middleware tookit developers have spent considerable time trying things out and finding what works best things will at least double again. But it takes time.

Yu Suzuki said, and i quote " For a techie like me, the PS3 is very attractive, but when you consider that both companies are delivering the quality that users want, I also believe that hardware like Xbox 360, which offers easy development, is important. As for Revolution, it' s very Nintendo-like in that it resets the game experience and starts with a new device."

He told IGN that he wanted to develop for whatever had the most horsepower (Gangsta already pointed this out), even if it was hard to develop for, leading everyone to presume he' s talking about PS3. I think he is too.

But Yoshinori Yamagishi, Producer at Square Enix said that it was difficult to see the future of the next genereation of console at this point, specifically because although the specs announced by Sony are impressive, there' s a lot of doubt as to whether thay are what they say they are.

I expect PS3' s CPU rate figures to be reduced, probably at DevStation in March. I think that the system specs will appear to be much closer to Microsofts than they are at the moment, but likely slightly better.

It' s hard to tell what information is genuine fact at the moment since the 4000 PS3 devkits only went out to developer while CES 2006 was running. The only people who would have a good idea on what to expect are people like Kojima.

We all know Nintendo are going to blast both 360 (which i own) and PS3 out of the water anyway! Gimme my nunchuku screen pointing thingy!

lol, thanks for the post majik. What u said about the 360 and ps3 is exactly what I' ve read about it, and you could go much more into detail but until we get facts, finished products, there is no point. Ur right when u say sony is good at hyping up a product. At E3 they showed the videos and said nothing about them, which left it open to discussion, realtime or pre-rendered? And obviously the n00bz decided to believe that video was realtime, u kno which one I' m talking about-the HALO KILLER, and already started saying the ps3 is gonna kick billsoft' s ass etc...That Killzone movie was pre-rendered animation. I was watching GameHEad on SPikeTV and they had an interview with Blur animation studios and the owner said they got offered to make that cg animation but he refused and some scottish dudes made it, but he confirmed it was pre-rendered.

I haven' t gone online to read much news, but has there been any word on the rev???

Not really, nothing official at least.

Kojima said that it would be " ..foolish..." for him to pass up the opportunity to work on Revolution (N5), which basically means he' ll be putting of a game for it eventually (probably not a MGS title).

Make of this what you will:-

“Metal Gear Solid' has traditionally been with Sony, and I still believe Sony is the best match in terms of the full complete package as a game software..”

“However, for the online aspect, this is not the case. I feel no doubt that the online portion alone could be out on either PC or Xbox, maybe not Revolution, but other formats as well. The online aspect is completely different to the package that we have produced in the past on PlayStation.”

Konami have already announced titles for 360. And with MGS2: Substance being released on Xbox previously, i would think that 360 will get MGS4 in some form.

Now i firmly believe that a 360 port will already be underway as Microsoft' s courtship of Konami, a key Japanese developer/publisher, continues apace. As to how long the PlayStation 3 will be able to claim Kojima' s next installment of the seminal stealth series will be interesting to see...

I think they just might do a multiplayer game only, for the 360. No storyline no nothing, or maybe a little storyline, but I think it will just be a multiplayer. any mgs on the 360 would be cool tho.

MGS Online for 360 would kick ass. Since Sony doesn' t seem to have an online strategy yet, i think this would do Microsoft a world of good!

Sony always overhypes their upcoming systems. It just makes the system that much more of a complete letdown when it arrives because it doesn' t match the hopes that Sony has raised for us.

Even more - their systems are so cheap that if you pay 500$ for PS3 (if that rumour appears to be true) and that bitch dies on you ,you' ll get rev or 360 next time.Not like with PS2 where people kept buying PS2' s even after they went dead.

I wonder if Sony realised how serious the competition has become.

That' s what i' ve been saying. They' re going after the home video market using PS3 to get Blu-Ray into peoples homes. They stand to make tons more money from people buying Blu-Ray DVD' s than games (since they only get a small percentage per game, and will likely lose money on every console).

Revolution will most probably be in full swing when PS3 makes it to the States and 360 will be on amazing 2nd generation titles. Sony know they' ll be playing catch up with a machine that' s blatantly technically inferior on some levels and only just superior on the rest. Stuff like 1080i doesn' t mean shit to some teenager, but it means a lot to the older lifestyle living consumer.

It' ll play games, but they won' t be it' s main focus...

4000 dev kit is out ...

Even if you break 2 legs from a crab it still runs!
What you gotta do is find its weak spot and do massive damage at it.

We know, they went out during CES and many developers have reported problems with them.

. They stand to make tons more money from people buying Blu-Ray DVD' s than games (since they only get a small percentage per game, and will likely lose money on every console).

It' s not that bad - they loose money on systems at the begining but in time production costs go low and when Sony' s babies start selling like crazy (after first-second year on the market) they are already profitable and the demand is incredible.

Revolution will most probably be in full swing when PS3 makes it to the States

I don' t think so - HD gaming is the hotest topic in US not Japan and MS will establish big user base in US.

Japan is safe for Sony - US is the warzone of HD gaming.

I believe that Rev will follow PS3 even in the US.

Ofcourse this is all just a pointles forum speculation and will be known for sure in the next few months.

I honestly don' t believe that PS3 is more powerful for gaming than 360 , but the opinions are 50/50 so I' ll have to wait.

Fortunately both PS3 and X360 are not PC' s and gaming experience on those system doesn' t depend on the hardwae but on the developer.(that actually makes PS3 the better system for having the best developers on it' s side while MS and their Non-PC allies in bigger number remain to be seen)

I dunno mate, Revolution' s expected Stateside in November (before christmas at least). Unless Sony pull their finger out they can' t hope to ship in the US before then, although anything is possible and the reason we haven' t heard abything could be due to them waiting to make a shock announcement...

I' ve heard Sony expects to ship between 4 and 7 million units THIS YEAR. Whicj i don' t believe. But we' ll know more after DevStation in March (the DevStation site has been updated too;
http://www.devstation.scee.com/)

Saying that, 360 seems to be the better performing console (an understanding of how the technology works is required to see this), and although games for PS3 have been announced to be in development, other than the obvious...

Metal Gear Solid 4
Devil May Cry 4
Tekken 6
Fifth Phantom Saga
Gradius
Ni-Oh

...there are no other reason' s i' m looking forward to the thing.

Meanwhile, the amount of good looking/sounding games for 360 is just silly...

Mass Effect
Too Human Trilogy
Gears of War
Dark Sector
Wardevil
Lost Planet
The Elder Scrolls: Oblivion
Ghost Recon 3
Splinter Cell: Double Agent
Splinter Cell 5
Dead Rising
Lost Odyssey
Blue Dragon
[EM] Enchant Arm
2 Days To Vegas
Alan Wake
Call of Duty 3
Black (360)
The Chronicles of Riddick 2
Def Jam 3
The Darkness
Dimitri
DoA: Code Chronus
Elveon
Fable 2
Huxley
Ninety-Nine Nights
Ninjagaiden 2 (Project Progressive)
Project Offset
Prey
Halo 3
Saints Row
Unnamed Rare games (Banjoe Threeie!!!)

...etc...

Then there' s the games that will likely make both systems, and the ones that may or may not make both but will make one of them...like...

Resident Evil 5
Unreal Tournament 2007 (confirmed for PS3, confirmed unofficially for 360)
Soul Calibur 4
GTA Next
Medal of Honour: Airbourne
BC
Omnikron 2
KOTOR3
Tenchu
Sonic The Hedgehog
Turok
Unreal 3
Virtua Fighter 5

...etc...

THEN, there' s Revolution to consider. Which i won' t go into here, but the next 4/5 years are gonna be f*cking brilliant if you like games (and if you don' t why are you here?!).

Sh1t, i think i' m just gonna buy the PS3 anyway since it' ll have games i want but won' t be able to get for 360 or Revolution anyway. But, will i pay the launch price if it' s $500, or for me, £400+?! I dunno, i need to see and here more from Sony before i even consider it.

The jump in graphical output on 360 once developers start using the 3 cores properly is going to be unbelieveable. Trust me!

We know, they went out during CES and many developers have reported problems with them.

Ahum k...
But itagaki burned down 4 xbox360 dev kit just for doa4,so im not supriced.

Even if you break 2 legs from a crab it still runs!
What you gotta do is find its weak spot and do massive damage at it.

ORIGINAL: QuezcatoL

We know, they went out during CES and many developers have reported problems with them.

Ahum k...
But itagaki burned down 4 xbox360 dev kit just for doa4,so im not supriced.

They were broken during testing (likely left on for way too long.

" Kikizo: So is there anything else you would like to comment on about Xbox 360 development, maybe something you encountered that you didn' t expect, that' s interesting to talk about?

Itagaki: For one, I received a Mac development machine from Microsoft - and so I realised for the first time that they [Microsoft and Apple] were actually good friends! That' s what surprised me the most. In testing the game, we overheated the machine - and broke a bunch of them!"