Hideo Kojima & MGS4

Ok, so we all saw the MGS4 trailer displayed at E3 (did anyone get there?) and watched Kojima prove it was running in realtime in a demonstration at TGS. But what is the game going to play like?!

In a blog on the companies website a couple of weeks ago he stated that' s a new system, which he refers to under the code name of " XXXX," has been implemented in the game' s development environment. Apparently, upon seeing this new system, the Kojima Production staffers exclaimed " Aah, now this is next generation!" .

Supposedly this new system, if implemented correctly, will give the game a different flavor from Metal Gear Solid, and will " likely be an industry first.."

Now i' m seriously interested in what he' s gonna do. MGS4 looks amazing, but i keep having to remind myself that it' s just a real-time cutscene, an all MGS cutscenes look nicer than when you' re playing it.

I don' t think he' s talking about a view change, rather something to do with Snakes eyepiece. Now i know PS3 will support 2 screens and i know Metal Gear Ac!d can be played with a set of funky goggle things to make it look 3D. Could Snake see the little Otacon robo thingy from the trailer, with his right eye? Something akin to Ghost Recons HUD where you can see other team members. Perhaps Snake will use it to scout ahead.

My point is more of a question, does anyone think Kojima is planning to impliment a dual-screen display for MGS4, and if so, how?

That would require the player to have at least two televisions available for the PS3. I don' t know if they are brave (or stupid) enough to require such from a buyer. The game will sell bad if they do like that and I don' t think they want that.
I think that the dual-screen (DS anyone? ) setup has to be made optional in the games. And since Kojima seems to put lots of focus on this new system, I doubt it will be something optional. I think his new system have something to do with gameplay, or perhaps a smaller peripheral that could be included in the package with the game.

I see your point. It' d be interesting if it was optional though!

What' s your take on MGS4 then?

On another note, is using that insanly big controller the only way to play Steel Batallion?

when people trashtalking dualscreen,let me ask you why?!
What is wrong with a ps3 playing on 2 tvs at the same time?
Mayby it work for lan?
1 ps3 for 2 tvs,what would be bad about that?
We seen mgs3 taking online form,probably 4 will have it too,and wouldn' t it be nice if we could play lan 3vs3 death match on the same ps3?

Even if you break 2 legs from a crab it still runs!
What you gotta do is find its weak spot and do massive damage at it.

nice quezcatol i like the idea although it' ll ve very expensive, but can' t ps3 display just on two regular TV' s that would be a lot more interesting to me , it' s even awesome !!

back to the subject, i think that the system Kojima was talking about has to do with a program not a hardware... may be some kind of coding program that will enhance considerable the graphics or may be the animation or the interaction or may be the A.I .... that' s what i think

I' m sure it can be shown on regular TV.

Even if you break 2 legs from a crab it still runs!
What you gotta do is find its weak spot and do massive damage at it.

I agree that it would be awesome if a game like MGS4 or any other game could be run on several TV' s but it' s just to much to ask for from the player. That' s why I prefer such features as optional.
I don' t think Kojimas system will enhance A.I. or graphics since he says it' s an " industry first" . It would be quite difficult to call a graphic or A.I. enhancing system that, no matter how revolutionizing it is.
My bet is that the system is enhanced gameplay or some kind of smaller peripheral. It will truly be interesting to see what it really is. Eye-Toy compatible maybe?

Abasoufiane back to the subject, i think that the system Kojima was talking about has to do with a program not a hardware... may be some kind of coding program that will enhance considerable the graphics or may be the animation or the interaction or may be the A.I .... that' s what i think

...good guess....

...here' s a recent, well informed article about the subject:

The plan is to make the game' s overall world more interactive and realistic than ever. " I want to create [a] kind of simulation world. [For example, in most games you have a tree but it' s basically a piece of plastic; a set piece.] There should be life in that tree. If we water the tree it will grow, if we burn the tree it will die." (2)

Kojima has implied that you will be able to drive vehicles for the first time in the series. " We will try to make Snake control anything that' s possible." (4)

There will be a " psychological aspect" to the game. " There is an intense fear when you point a gun at someone. I want to represent that in MGS4...that' s what real combat is all about." Kojima plans on consulting a real psychologist in order to flesh out this aspect.(1) He also says that the A.I. will be so realistic-so much like playing against other real people-that using psychology against them will be crucial.(2) The bad guys will use it against you, too; Kojima gave an example of the new Metal Gear robots (in the second MGS4 trailer) emitting various peaceful countryside noises (including cicada, horse, and cow noises) to lull the player into a false sense of ease before attacking.(2)

Not all characters in MGS4 will be enemies. You may step into a battlefield between two foreign powers-depending on your actions or whom you kill, you can make friends or enemies with one or both countries (and thus their soldiers in the battlefield). What you do in one stage can also affect later stages of the game; if you help one country defeat another in a level, the defeated country may not be around in the next mission. There will also be innocent people not directly involved in the conflict in the war zone.(1)

The MGS4 team is planning to include a feature that allows you to control Otacon' s robot to scout ahead, although it may not happen if the team decides it doesn' t work well.(4)

The Close Quarters Combat (or CQC) system from MGS3 will return in some form in the game.(4)

But as for the healing, hunting, and camouflage systems from MGS3, " Some of them might carry on into MGS4, but since the theme is battlefield, we might implement them differently," says Kojima. " We will try to create a system that is best suited for that battlefield. There' s bullets flying around everywhere, so you don' t have time to go hunting for a frog to eat."

Hmm, well it seems he wants to enhance just about everything from graphics to A.I. to physics. But I don' t get where this " industry first" thing could be in the picture...
Industry first sounds like something we have never thought about before. But enhanced physics, A.I. and graphics, I mean, isn' t that to be expected?

Its all hype-talk (most likely turn out to be a PSP-link aspect), i dont expect any gameplay groundbreaking from PS3/360 as they have the same foundations as their predecessors, (standard left/right analogue joypads, which have been used/experiemnted to death), only maybe advanced AI and graphics/environments details, but certainly not gameplay-wise..

The Revolution is clearly designed for groundbreaking gameplay not PS3.. (we know Hideo is working on a game for Revolution)

ginjirou

about " first in the industry" , there was once where " pixel shaders" were first in the industry,
take for exemple the animatyion , " motion capture" was once first in the industry

and what is that latest technology that said to be implemented in Oblivion and some other games, it has to do with plants how they grow and how they should look . if for exemple i can see a plant in the begining of X game and that same plant has grown by the end of the game, wouldn' t that be a first in the industry ???

and there are so many exemple so you see? may be kojima created a system or a code call it what you want so that graphics will leave the rest to dust, or may be the AI and so on ...

.... when it comes to industry hype, can anything beat the Revolution and it' s " revolutionary" controller?....

..you might think of Nintendo as a company amidst it' s home-console making death-throws... ..desperately trying to generate decent consumer interest, so that more than three people actually buy their new machine when it comes out....

....in my opinion, a game like Resident Evil 4, is ' revolutionary' and an ' industry first' .... ....Kijoma-san is surely capable of creating an action game just as innovative....

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PSP linking doesn' t sound " industry new" either. Maybe I should just give up on that word and assume it' s something boring everyone can easily think off. But then, it is Kojima we are talking about, not Sony. I have faith in him. Groundbreaking gameplay doesn' t necessarily come from new ways to control the games. New gameplay ideas and peripherals (PS2 had Eye-Toy, karaoke-mics, electric quitarrs, microphones, and such) can make a game groundbreaking as well. Nintendo has hyped gameplay=controller just as much as Sony has hyped gameplay=graphics. I think the middle way is the right way to go. A little if both.
Sony should have some credit for one thing you usually don' t think about: they were the first to use DUAL analog setup. It surprises me that Nintendo didn' t make an analog stick instead of c-buttons on the N64.
I think RE4 was revolutionary for its genre and the series but not for the entire industry.

....i think Resi 4 is revolutionary for two of the most popular genres in games today: 3rd Person Action/Adventure (where the series began) and FPS (since it plays a lot like one, but better).....

...considering how popular these formats are these days, it could be considered more or less revolutionary for the industry...

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But why is RE4 revolutionary? Sure, the quality is a step forward, it' s a next-gen game today, but it doesn' t bring anything new in gameplay or technology. It' s just amazingly good in any way. I can' t consider it an FPS though. That would make MGS, Headhunter Splinter Cell FPS games.

RE4 is not revolutionary although it is an excellent game but there was no revolutionary idea, " almost" everything was done in a very good way

RE4 doesn' t play at all like an FPS, the guy doesn' t even staff left or right, and that' s it' s weakest point, RE4 control was not that good and i just finished the game two days ago, my memory is still fresh

one exemple of 3rd action game that plays a lot like FPS is Max payne series but certainly not resident evil even if you burst anything that moves

I agree. I think an FPS has to have the ability to move the character and aim at the same time. This was unfortunately not possible in RE4 where you had to stand still in order to aim.

...unlike Metal Gear or Splinter cell, the core gameplay mechanic in Resi 4 is shooting based......

...intelligent reloading, accurate aiming, specific targeting of various body parts, shooting enemy projectiles out of the air, individual weapon handling, customising etc...

...I think that it is the meeting of 3rd person and FPS which makes it so inspired .... ...and how these mechanics are implemented during the game..... the camera angle makes the game immersive but yet allows you to maintain a strong connection with the lead character (something which FPS can' t do, since you instantly forget who your supposed to be playing as once the cut-scenes end) .......

...actually Metal Gear does feel like an FPS in some sections...

EDIT:

This was unfortunately not possible in RE4 where you had to stand still in order to aim.

expect this to change in Resi 5

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ginjirou supported better my idea


now mister bishonen from where did you get this line , i swear i' ve seen it somewhere damn my head is hurting because of you

" (something which FPS can' t do, since you instantly forget who your supposed to be playing as once the cut-scenes end)"

oh maybe it was yourself in some other thread

.....yeah i have used that line before... ...but because it was so damm good i decided to use it again!..

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For those who think the revolution is mostly hype..


Just look at the DS in contrast, that was also ' hyped' at/before release (tho nowhere near asmuch as the PSP).

DS is now delivering the goods, selling like hot cakes and has games the PSP can never possibly recreate .. I really see Revolution doing the same if done right,, (maybe not totally donimating Sony in sales but having the titles its competitors can only dream of. due to advanced control/devices)

...no offence, but i think the DS is just another hand-held with a extra screen gimmick...

...is the second screen truly vital for it' s games? or could they have all be made on the GBA, minus the gimmick??...........

...hell, don' t even half the DS' s games lack a valid use for it?...

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ORIGINAL: Bishonen

...no offence, but i think the DS is just another hand-held with a extra screen gimmick...

...is the second screen truly vital for it' s games? or could they have all be made on the GBA, minus the gimmick??...........

...hell, don' t even half the DS' s games lack a valid use for it?...

Ha, well it' s the fastest selling piece of gaming hardware ever and it' s killing PSP sales in Japan. Games like Super Mario 64 DS and Mario Kart DS could have been done on 1 screen but things like Warioware Touched and Yoshi; Touch & Go and Nintendogs definately make good use of the dual screen nature of the unit.

As for whether the PS3 will support 2 SDTV' s, yes ofcourse it will. Rumours are that Sony is making a new kind of panoramic HDTV that will be useful for the dual-screen nature of PS3, though i don' t quite get what the tv will be like...kinda lost there!

And i think Kojima is going to impliment something really different, be it additional harware bundled with the game, or something optional etc. He made his claims AFTER Nintendo had announced their controller, so anything slight like improved visuals, AI, camera angle etc couldn' t really be considered a big indusrty first. He' s a really talented guy and this is supposedly (again) his last MGS title, so he' ll want to go out with a bang.

...no offence, but i think the DS is just another hand-held with a extra screen gimmick...

...is the second screen truly vital for it' s games? or could they have all be made on the GBA, minus the gimmick??...........

...hell, don' t even half the DS' s games lack a valid use for it?...

No offence, but its usually people who havent played a DS before say things like that.. i was one of em at first untill i brought one and not long after sold my PSP for more DS games and never looked back..

I hope Kojima will decide to make a 360 game once developers get their hands on XNA. He' ll probabily make some crazy game, considering how much easier it will be to develop for 360 once XNA is out, and considering how the 360 is right up there with the ps3, and is better at some things but worse at others.

I actually believe that Kojima considers that an industry first, interactivity at a HUGE scale in a game with the surroundings, and realism. There has been no game that has all of what Kojima said would be cool to have in a game (what he said in the quote on the previous page).

How come he' s developing for rev and not 360? im buying all 3 consoles, but damn y do some japanese game makers leave the western console out of it?

You could do most DS games for other consoles or especially the PC where the mouse can be used for " touching" while the monitor is split in two sections. However, that wouldn' t have been near as fun as playing the games on the DS and fun is what games are all about.

ORIGINAL: KiLLeR

I hope Kojima will decide to make a 360 game once developers get their hands on XNA. He' ll probabily make some crazy game, considering how much easier it will be to develop for 360 once XNA is out, and considering how the 360 is right up there with the ps3, and is better at some things but worse at others.

I actually believe that Kojima considers that an industry first, interactivity at a HUGE scale in a game with the surroundings, and realism. There has been no game that has all of what Kojima said would be cool to have in a game (what he said in the quote on the previous page).

How come he' s developing for rev and not 360? im buying all 3 consoles, but damn y do some japanese game makers leave the western console out of it?

Konami are already developing for 360, but Kojima and his team haven' t actually looked at the system, properly yet. He has hinted about making a game for 360 though at some point and making full use of the insanely good Xbox Live. An online MMPMGS? Ha, probably a game similar to Ghost Recon 2' s multiplayer function actually. Remember that it' s Kojimas last MGS game, but Konami will be continuing the series. I wouldn' t be surprised if they had already decided to do a MGS for 360.

Anyone getting MGS3 Subsistence?

...yeah, my still new-smelling slim PS2 needs something other than Resi 4 to chew on.... ...i don' t think I' ll bother with Sony' s laughable attempt at an online service though....

...and as I' ve never really seen any merit in hand-held gaming, I' ll just keep my mouth shut about DS and PSP....

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Hey Majik, are you referring to that 1up interview where Kojima hinted on the possibility of a MGS Online on the 360? MGS might continue from Konami, but not Kojima Productions. I don' t think it will be the same ppl making the game, and I was talking about the same ppl, Kojima Productions, with Kojima supervising, making a 360 game. I would love to see how they could use the online feature of the 360.

ORIGINAL: KiLLeR

Hey Majik, are you referring to that 1up interview where Kojima hinted on the possibility of a MGS Online on the 360? MGS might continue from Konami, but not Kojima Productions. I don' t think it will be the same ppl making the game, and I was talking about the same ppl, Kojima Productions, with Kojima supervising, making a 360 game. I would love to see how they could use the online feature of the 360.

It' d be nice but i can' t see it happening. Although it' s only Kojima and character designer Mr Shinkawa' s last MGS. I believe the rest of the team at Kojima Productions will continue doing MGS games.

And yes, 1UP, and somewhere else i think, maybe IGN.

On that note, obviously we all like Kikizo, but what other game sites do people visit?

I' m quite partial to gamespot, ign, gametrailers, gamershell, 1up, kikizo (obviously) and 360 specific sites.

yeah, my brother is buying subsistence and i am hooking up psonline as we speak, as for mgs4, I' m of the opinion that there will be unscripted AI battles all over a non linear map. think of the map as a large square, then firefights break out in the northeast, and southwest corners. one force overtakes the other, and then rushes to the other side of the map to continue combat with the other battalion, with snake right in the middle of it. i think the encounters will be a lot less scripted, with soldiers not having the time to weed out aging espionage agents from buildings. this would provide a revolutionary sense of chaos never before seen on console gaming. i think the trailer conveys the theme " no where to hide" because your enemies are always moving and turning the tides of battle around you. imagine collecting info on troops, with you inside a far-away building, only for the other force to charge into your hidey-hole on their way into combat.

ORIGINAL: Bishonen
...here' s a recent, well informed article about the subject:

please always provide link/credit when quoting from any articles.

I visit Kikizo, Magicbox, and GameSpot.

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

I' d have to say that the " industry first" Kojima and co. are talking about is emotion. Random, situational emotion. And not just fear/retreat instincts either, after all we' ve had those since the mid to late 90' s. I mean confidence, uncertainty, srewdness, awareness and luck all rolled into an A.I. And if they include an engine that will randomize these factors, it could be that every single
play-through will be completely different and require a unique strategy every time.

But that wouldn' t mean anything if it didn' t directly affect the games narrative and MGS is a series that has everything based in a well thought out story.

I can see where you' re going with that.

well, if the playstation 3 has the sort of capabilities Die_Hounderdoggen is speculating on, then i' m without a doubt purchasing one. you' d have to love an mgs game with huge replay value like that would give us. well, unless sony comes out with some rock solid details, which will be at the very least, 2 or 3 months before the playstation 4 comes out, i wouldn' t put too much hope in this.

It wouldn' t be in the hardware, it' d be sofware technology.

Kojima already stated that he could produce the same game on 360 with no problems.

I just wish Sony would release some damn details so we can put all the speculation to rest, bring on the Miracle, the second coming of christ, the rebirth of the Roman empire and the discovery of faster than light travel, all hail... Playstation

Man, just when i was starting to really look forward to it...

[image]http://images.google.co.uk/url?q=http://www.ps3land.com/images/concepts/ps3magscan.jpg[/image]

What on earth is that on the picture?