WOW! Xbox 360 didn' t really have a good E3 showing!

I know the games were still early but talk about an underwhelming presence...

Every game had framerate issues in some way. Some incredibly minor and others more noticeable..

Sega' s offerings were quite disappointing to be honest.. The dark and gritty, ' Condemned Criminal Origins' looked like a First-person bore with inconsistent framerates. Full Auto was definitely better and was sorta like a next-gen version of Road Blasters that utilized what' s quickly becoming the now overused REWIND feature!

Need for Speed was a bit ' meh' as well, graphics were nice but " nice" just doesn' t cut it for a future generation console and the game had its own little issues...

And DO NOT get me started on the videos I' ve seen of Test Drive Unlimited... Simply WOW! I thought I was watching a first-generation Xbox game in motion..
Pop-up and fluctuating framerates. I can' t wait till some developer tries to tell us how slowdown and framerate problems will be a thing of the past with the arrival of the Xbox360, Playstation 3, and Revolution.. I remember when some of the idiots said that about the Xbox, GameCube, and Playstation 2!


Overall I' d have to say that out of all the games at the show the WORST Framerate award actually went to an Xbox title. JAWS Unleashed... NEVER in my life have I seen a game' s framerate take a nosedive so badly that it made even the Super Nintendo' s slowest games seem speedy by comparison, lol..



p.s.- That Dead Or Alive 4 video did look pretty badass in ' some' spots though!

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

Were you actually able to play any of the Xbox360 demos?

Just Need For Speed... I played it twice. The Condemned and Full Auto gaming setups were always occupied. Would have liked to give Full Auto a try. NOT Condemned..

Xbox360 controller feels NICE!! Definitely a significant improvement over the current Xbox controller!

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

That' s good to hear. I never really cared for the buttons on the current Xbox controllers. They felt too stiff or something. How do the buttons feel when you press them compared to say, the Saturn controller, or the Dreamcast? Or the Sega Master System? On the SMS the buttons pressed down nearly a half an inch. I always jumped and fired too late.

The Xbox360 controller is a really snug fit.

The problem I have with the current Xbox controller is that the button placement feels a little odd.. The Xbox controller is the only controller that I find myself still looking down at sometimes while playing a game just to make sure I' m hitting the correct buttons. And let' s not forget those two annoying buttons on the lower right portion of the controller, I almost always forget they' re even there, lol.. Then you have the start and back button on the left side of the controller which felt awkward as well..

The Xbox360 controller fixes a lot of those issues.. For starters the feel of the controller is a bit softer than the Xbox controller. The placement of the face buttons also feels a lot better now and the button to access the console' s media center is conveniently placed at the top center spot of the controller making it easy to quickly tap it with your thumb or index finger. Everything about the controller felt softer.

Definitely felt better than the Dreamcastro controller but that' s not hard to do given the major step backwards that the Dreamcast controller was when compared to the godly Saturn pad. Of course no controller can hope to compare to the Saturn pad but as far as 3D controllers go, the Xbox360 version is off to a great start.

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

Awesome! I can' t wait until they redisign it completely for the worse!

Every game had framerate issues in some way. Some incredibly minor and others more noticeable..

Sounds like Star Wars Episode III. What a pitiful game that is.

And let' s not forget those two annoying buttons on the lower right portion of the controller, I almost always forget they' re even there, lol..

That' s why I bought Gamestop' s Xbox controller -- the two buttons are in the top right and the controller is also larger and fits better in the hand.

That' s why I bought Gamestop' s Xbox controller -- the two buttons are in the top right and the controller is also larger and fits better in the hand.

Sounds like the original Xbox controller (the Duke). I still use it, btw. Boy the original sure was made for big, manly hands.

You were playing the games on a Mac G5 which is only around 30% as powerful as the final build which explains the issues with frame rate and such.

Did you get to actually play any PS3 games... didn' t think so.

XBL Gamertag: Rampage99

" Basically, pollute the air all you want, your just speeding up the inevitable. Our future generations are f*cked as it is and there' s really nothing we can do about it. Have a nice day "

Actually, I think it was 2 G5s running side-by-side, so that should be roughly 60% of the final system' s power. Could be wrong, though.

Artistic merit is more important than technical excellence

It was 30% power...read that in some E3 article. Anyways, Penny Arcade mentioned today that the only console that was really launched at this years E3 was the Xbox 360. They mentioned the demo of " Gears of War" ...so yeah...just wanted to mention that.

In response to the following complaint I have decided to change my signature:

" by the way, yoshimitsu you might want to click the little checkbox that makes your signature disappear." -Jonah Shoemaker, Residential Dumbass

I love this 30% the power bullshit Microsoft is trying to spout!!!! Just like sony' s PS2 crap they tried to yap about 5 years ago. Companies should just learn to say " yeah, it' s early stages sorry that things don' t look great, it takes time" Not make up lame excuses only to dissapoint fans later.

Are you kidding me? I don' t think you' ve seen the press conference. As far as I' m concerned, Xbox360 is the future of video games. It seems like you' ve went on for paragraphs about the console' s graphic capabilities and completely overlooked the social aspect and variety of games already in production. Also, I noticed you didn' t mention how great the PlayStation 3 pre-rendered tech demos played. Give me a break.

Are you kidding me? I don' t think you' ve seen the press conference. As far as I' m concerned, Xbox360 is the future of video games. It seems like you' ve went on for paragraphs about the console' s graphic capabilities and completely overlooked the social aspect and variety of games already in production. Also, I noticed you didn' t mention how great the PlayStation 3 pre-rendered tech demos played. Give me a break.

Why should I have seen the press conference? I was standing right in front of some of the playable games.. How is the press conference better than that? And of course I went on and on and on and ON about the console' s graphic capabilities since Microsoft themselves did just that when the specs were released. And like it or not the graphic capabilities of all of these next-gen consoles will always be called into question..

Take a look at Test Drive Unlimited and tell me you' re impressed by that game. lol.. I didn' t overlook the social aspect of the console, I simply just don' t care about it ;). I buy games based on the type of single player experience they provide. I' m not looking to hang out in some virtual hub of sorts chatting it up with others.

The variety of games in development is impressive especially with Square Enix releasing one of their heavy hitters but the main point of this thread was about the playable games on hand and how underwhelming they were.

The PS3 and Revolution games would have been judged exactly the same way but there were none on hand...

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

It seems like you' ve went on for paragraphs about the console' s graphic capabilities

Yes, this is always a great sign that a console will be great. It' s enough for me, I' m sold. After all, the other systems will surely be sorely lacking in this dept. and if M$ sais it, it' s got to be true.

The whole social aspect and variety of games, again things that neither of the other systems will be bringing to the table. I hear Sony has decided to only allow Gran Turisimo games for the PS3, and Nintendo is backing off the whole Revolution thingy and decided to just name their system " Nintendo same-as-last-time" .

And I guess the reason you didn' t see me talk about the PS3' s pre-rendered BS at E3 is becuase you didn' t bother checking any of the threads dealing with discussions about the PS3' s pre-rendered BS, or else you surely would have seen me mention it.

ORIGINAL: mxpx182

I love this 30% the power bullshit Microsoft is trying to spout!!!! Just like sony' s PS2 crap they tried to yap about 5 years ago. Companies should just learn to say " yeah, it' s early stages sorry that things don' t look great, it takes time" Not make up lame excuses only to dissapoint fans later.

But they were running on G5s with underpowered graphics cards. It really is the truth that they were on systems only 30% as powerful as the system. It was not on the console at all infact. The G5 only has one power PC core while the 360 has 3. The ATi card that' s in the 360 is also far more advanced than any card on the market and includes integrated ram which has never been done before. They aren' t lying when they made that statement.

XBL Gamertag: Rampage99

" Basically, pollute the air all you want, your just speeding up the inevitable. Our future generations are f*cked as it is and there' s really nothing we can do about it. Have a nice day "

I still don' t understand how G5' s are associated with the Xbox360. Can someone enlighten me please?

Actually nearly all G5 systems are dual processors.

Jars, the Xbox360 hardware is not ready, so the games are being programmed and run on Macs right now. It is likely that these first-gen games that are running poorly on Macs probably won' t run very well onb the 360 either... since they were made on the Mac and all. The final official MS Xbox360 development system will probably STILL be on a Mac, but I have heard that they don' t have a final development system ready to go yet.

The bottom line here: Macs are cool and Xbox Live is really not all that great.

Dude, if the software is more advanced tham what the G5 can handle of course it' s gonna bog down. that' s like saying WartCraft 3 sucked on a computer from 1999 with no up grades and that it would suck equally on a brand new Alienware. They won' t run poorly on the 360, plus they still have like six months to work on the games.

XBL Gamertag: Rampage99

" Basically, pollute the air all you want, your just speeding up the inevitable. Our future generations are f*cked as it is and there' s really nothing we can do about it. Have a nice day "

Slow down Rampage, Joe' s got a valid point, Every system that has ever launched has always had launch games that were less impressive than the tech demoes and previous games shown running on Dev kits. I have absolutely no reason to believe that this time will be any different. Sony' s already done it with there PS3 vids, and I' m sure Nintendo will do it with the first Revolution stuff they show. It seems pretty obvious to me that you love Microsoft, and that' s fine, I' m just as much of a fanboy to Nintendo, but I' d rather be pleasantly surprised by a system because I expected less than be let down by a system because I believed all the pre-launch BS hype the company barfed out at me before launch.

The bottom line here: Macs are crap and Xbox Live is really not all that great.

The *other* bottom line is that the Xbox360 games that appeared at E3 did absolutely nothing to convince me that it was future generation stuff.. MOST of them wouldn' t have even been impressive as regular Xbox titles let alone Xbox360 games.

With the amount of horsepower that thing is supposed to have I was hoping to get blown away by at least one of the playable titles on hand.. None of them did that, the only game that sorta impressed me wasn' t playable at all, it was the lengthy Dead or Alive 4 video, and it was actually one level - the area in the game where they' re fighting in traffic and a car smashes right into Bass I think. The plethora of neon lights, the solid visual quality, it all looked superb.

I haven' t written any of the E3 Xbox360 showcases off as I think there' s a good chance they could be further improved upon in time for the 360' s launch, but as far as initial impressions go, I found all of them to be pretty underwhelming titles.

Terry Bogard - currently the most Unhelpful member of the Kikizo forums.

Joe: Perhaps your problem with Xbox Live are the games, and not the actual system. You mentioned in another thread about Xbox having so many FPS' s out.

Anyways...if I hadn' t played Sony online then I might agree that it' s overrated or whatever. When I compared the two, Xbox Live was the more enjoyable lag-free experience.

mxpx: How are we supposed to take you seriously when you admit you are a Nintendo fanboy?

In response to the following complaint I have decided to change my signature:

" by the way, yoshimitsu you might want to click the little checkbox that makes your signature disappear." -Jonah Shoemaker, Residential Dumbass

Does this mean that Xbox360 hardware is patterned after Mac G5 architecture?

Anyway, concerning the Xbox360 showcase at E3... MS hasn' t been known to have strong " first showings" . I remember when Bill Gates showcased the Xbox for the first time. They only had 2 games in development to show, Oddworld (recently stolen from the PS2), and the de funct " Malice" . Both ran at extremely choppy framerates (like the games showcased now). While i can' t say both games became jaw-dropping at release, at least compare what games they showed before launch, to the games they had at launch.

So... let' s just enjoy our pre-launch bashing... and not get our hopes too high, or too low.

mxpx: How are we supposed to take you seriously when you admit you are a Nintendo fanboy?

Easy. I admit that I love Nintendo, now maybe your definition of fanboy and mine are different, I don' t mean I' ll buy every nintendo product ever and will praise there virtues over obvious shortcomings, rather that I will always support NIntendo' s main francihises, and look forward to them as long as I continue to enjoy them (which I still am). If you look at my posts yoshimitsu you will see I always take a wait and see aproach with companies. I don' t owe them anything, I am the consumer, it is up to them to impress me. Even in my revolution topics, you will see I have much skepticism in what NIntendo is doing, and why not, they' ve done nothing with revolution to alleviate skepticism. Being a fan of something in no way removes my ability to stand back and take an unbiased look at the industry as a whole, and I was trying to tell everybody to do that, stand back and see what is your favorite company doing for you. They owe you, they' re in it for the money, we' re in cause we like games, and don' t ever let anyone else tell you otherwise. If Halo' s your favorite game, or someother x-box exclusive then I fully understand that you are pumped up by the impending 360, just don' t get sucked in to believing all this " best case scenario, in a dream world" hype that Microsoft (or sony or Nintendo when the time comes) start yapping about.

Dude, I don' t think you read my post right. The stuff MS showed weren' t tech demos. People are talking about how poor the actual games looked and I' m just trying to say that they were running on a computer that only has a third of the power of the 360. At least they showed real games and not a bunch of tech demos and CG videos.

XBL Gamertag: Rampage99

" Basically, pollute the air all you want, your just speeding up the inevitable. Our future generations are f*cked as it is and there' s really nothing we can do about it. Have a nice day "

Macs are awesome. That' s why Revolution, PS3, and Xbox360 will all be based on similar architecture. If PCs were better then they' d base the consoles on PC technology, but they didn' t because they know PCs suck ass! Ha!

I' m glad we settled this.