LittleBigPlanet delayed due to Quran quotes

Ok Lets assume that the only things you take from Islam are the values and virtues that you agree with and none of the bullshit.  Moderate Christians do this too.  Can't you take these values which have existed before any religion without calling yourself Islamic or Christian.  Or is the mythology really so important for your identity?  What do you gain by attaching values to a religion?

The greatest lie that religion feeds people is that you need religion for morality.  Nothing can be further from the truth.  True morality canott be measured by any action alone.  This is how religions set things up.  They give you a list of actions that you can't do.  This is not morality.  Morality is approaching each situation as a unique event.  The moral action is the one that will provide the best results.   Morality has to do with predicting consequences.  This is why the same action can be bad while at other times it can be good.  Subjective morality.  Religion teaches objective morality and it's wrong.

The reason I say this is because like it or not.  Christianity and Islam are involved in things that are wrong and evil, and this isn't just modern extremists.  I'm talking about the fundamental ideas that always existed with these religions.  I don't see how you can seperate yourself from these atrocities and still call yourself a devote follower.  It doesn't work this way.  When you call yourself a person of Islam or Christian you promote and encourage everything about it wheather you want to or not.  This is a practical reality.  All you need to do is look at the news and see the results.  There are nations where the laws are taken directly from these religious texts.   I'm talking about courts of law here, not a minority of extremists.

This is why I don't call myself a liberal or Conservative.  Neither party does everything right.  Bother are fuckups.  I don't even ascribe to ideas on how I belive a country should be run.  Every situation is different and every country is different.  The ideal solution for one country can be polar opposite from another.  And these may change over time. 

This is how I view religion.  They're solutions to a set of problems.  The answer to an equation.  Maybe it was the right answer 2000 years ago but today it's entirely wrong.

I would like to add more as a response to the news of LBP being delayed for censorship.  Rational people do not get offended, ever. 

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

Just to be clear I am actually Muslim, heh.  UK born, Bangladeshi parents, brought up in the way of the Megadrive.

At the end of the day, I dont want to persuade anyone else to change their mind about Islam - people can believe in anything they want as long as it doesn't affect me, my family or friends.  I'm being honest, I'm selfish that way.  If people are interested in discussing my beliefs I'm always pleased to chat, even if they are hard questions that I might not know.

But one hadith that stays relevant here is one that goes along the lines of - no one person can say another person is right or wrong, good or bad.  At the end of the day everyone has a mix of both, some apparent and some hidden within.  So noone should judge another person.

In my experience, people in the UK embrace that quality the most, and its why I like living here.  My best friend is openly atheist. He's a good guy though, intelligent and we have some good banter.  He doesn't believe in a god as such, but he's deeply philosophical about the nature of life itself.  At the end of it all, how do I know that he didn't have it right all along, just by being who he is. 

Ok Lets assume that the only things you take from Islam are the values and virtues that you agree with and none of the bullshit.  Moderate Christians do this too.  Can't you take these values which have existed before any religion without calling yourself Islamic or Christian.  Or is the mythology really so important for your identity?  What do you gain by attaching values to a religion?

The greatest lie that religion feeds people is that you need religion for morality.  Nothing can be further from the truth.  True morality canott be measured by any action alone.  This is how religions set things up.  They give you a list of actions that you can't do.  This is not morality.  Morality is approaching each situation as a unique event.  The moral action is the one that will provide the best results.   Morality has to do with predicting consequences.  This is why the same action can be bad while at other times it can be good.  Subjective morality.  Religion teaches objective morality and it's wrong.

The reason I say this is because like it or not.  Christianity and Islam are involved in things that are wrong and evil, and this isn't just modern extremists.  I'm talking about the fundamental ideas that always existed with these religions.  I don't see how you can seperate yourself from these atrocities and still call yourself a devote follower.  It doesn't work this way.  When you call yourself a person of Islam or Christian you promote and encourage everything about it wheather you want to or not.  This is a practical reality.  All you need to do is look at the news and see the results.  There are nations where the laws are taken directly from these religious texts.   I'm talking about courts of law here, not a minority of extremists.

This is why I don't call myself a liberal or Conservative.  Neither party does everything right.  Bother are fuckups.  I don't even ascribe to ideas on how I belive a country should be run.  Every situation is different and every country is different.  The ideal solution for one country can be polar opposite from another.  And these may change over time. 

This is how I view religion.  They're solutions to a set of problems.  The answer to an equation.  Maybe it was the right answer 2000 years ago but today it's entirely wrong.

I would like to add more as a response to the news of LBP being delayed for censorship.  Rational people do not get offended, ever. 

Like I said stuff you see on the news is separate to Islam imo.  Those atrocities are in the name of Islam but in reality are based in politics or whatever and bend the truth to their aim.

I think you're right, you can have morality without religion.  I just think you can get to the same point from different angles.  For me religion merely makes me think about the nature of this reality.  Are we really going to die and turn into nothingness, or are we just a cat in a box with no concept of the outside world ie whats outside of our universe, or indeed whats smaller than quantum physics.   Many scientists agree that in the  end you have to at some point become an absolute entity to make logical sense.

Then again,who said it needs to be logical.

the problem we're facing today in modern islamic societies is that people are picking whatever they can do and leave the rest, in fact what happens is a mixture between islamic law and westerns laws (in out case morocco, it's the french law) , therefore what god set as rules get contradictions , it spread chaos , confusions between people. Islam is set as an entity, it's notonly a religion it's a law and a way of life and it needs to be accepted as a whole, if you neglect some areas from the chariaa,then the other aspects that are BASED on the one you neglect lose meaning.

if we have followed the coran exactly , and what mohamed said in his "hadiths" , i believe muslims won't be in this weak spot today. corruptions , illiteracy, pauverty , is what lead  to chaos in muslim countries. How ironic, we claim to have the greatest and final religion yet we are now in the rock bottom and islam as we practice it today has a lot to do with it.

Agent, i'm not speaking about which religion is better and why religion is great in my previous posts, that was at least not my main point. this is a whole different story. i'm talking about the obvious for many believers, god exists, and i hope you read what i wrote, may be you can understand.

Listen to the wise

no one person can say another person is right or wrong, good or bad. At the end of the day everyone has a mix of both, some apparent and some hidden within. So noone should judge another person.

Fair enough but this contradicts a lot of Islamic text.

i'm talking about the obvious for many believers, god exists, and i hope you read what i wrote, may be you can understand.

I'd understand if I see evidence.

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

Choupolo , your a muslim ??  now that's the best twist ever since prison break season 1 !!  :p  just kidding

Listen to the wise

Hehe, I though I'd mentioned this before.

Fair enough but this contradicts a lot of Islamic text.

Which parts exactly?

Agent , you have no idea about islam, islam is extremly complexe , as i said it's not a simple religion. you need a very knowledgable person in that subject so he can answer your questions. and did you see that you tube video i posted, it's amazing .

Listen to the wise

Hehe, I though I'd mentioned this before.

You did, I remember.  I hope you don't take what I'm saying personally by the way.  Even though I feel strongly about my position that doesn't mean I judge people by these standards.  In my mind we're just discussing philosophy, I don't have anything invested in any of this.  You and Aba are great guys as far as I can tell.

Fair enough but this contradicts a lot of Islamic text.

Which parts exactly?

Anything that's stated as fact.  Which is a lot of text, including that very sentence itself.  Islam is filled with guidelines on how to behave in the right fashion.  It's filled with things that are stated as fact even without evidence let along proof.  The easiest example is Allah or God.  There's nothing wrong with stating something as fact if you support it with evidence or at least have some logic behind it.  When you diagnose a patient, you don't do it using faith, you do it using years of experience/knowledge and tests.

Besides the fact that you want an afterlife to exist what kind of evidence supports the idea?  It's hardly surprising that a living organism invents a story that refutes mortality.  It's in our nature to survive, life wouldn't exist if it wasn't.  I find it a little convenient that this massive story of immortality is completely unprovable and immeasurable.  How did we make this discovery in the first place if we can't percieve it?  The only logical answer is that we made it up.  Just like the thousands of other deities that have existed throughout different societies.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=ahWFiaGATnY

 None of us have heard about most of them, they disappear when the society disappears.  Who's going to worship Allah when the Human race dies?

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

Thank you AGent, yes we're discussing on a phylosophical level because i think it's a fascinating subject, specialy when i have this opportunity to talk with atheists and listen to how they reason.

Who's going to worship Allah when the Human race dies?

In the coran god says after every single living being is dead, even the angel of death, the last one, and you know just before the resurection :  " to whom belong everyting" and then he answers himself " to  god the all mighty"

Actualy agent that question is irrelevent , specialy to you, you don't need this answer, it's beyond anyone else, and i'll put it that way, its god's business. that's what i don't understand , we are speaking about a being who supposedly created the universe, who knows everything and he's everywhere, how can you still apply  "logic" when every religion is based on that??? i can't argue with you? because you're aiming "faith".  it's doesn't have to be logical, may be not on the human intelligence level, who are we anyway , you do understand that we are extremely weak.

why haven't you commented , you or vx, on that dialogue i wrote, yes it sounds stupid but it's made on purpose , it has some great points there that needs to be discussed, i want to hear your point of view. why are you focusing on some questions nobody can answer that is the basic of faith.   like,  who created god? what was before god? how can an afterlife be real? 

if we really apply logic , then i would say well everything has a begining , the universe has a begining , i mean you can't creat something from nothing right??  so who created the big bang , ok who created  whetever tiny thing that made the universe ? who pushed that explosion ? how ?  OF course you cannot answer, you will let your mind go to the past , billions of years ago and you will reach the point of " and who created this ?"  seriously if i keep thinking about that my head hurts , it's beyond my human capacity.

Listen to the wise

I hope you don't take what I'm saying personally by the way.  Even though I feel strongly about my position that doesn't mean I judge people by these standards.  In my mind we're just discussing philosophy, I don't have anything invested in any of this.

Not at all, it gets me thinking too.  Not too many people really even like to think about this kinda stuff, they're content to let time pass without giving it a single glance.  Not that we can do anything about it whatever happens.

Islam is filled with guidelines on how to behave in the right fashion.  It's filled with things that are stated as fact even without evidence let along proof.  The easiest example is Allah or God.  There's nothing wrong with stating something as fact if you support it with evidence or at least have some logic behind it.  When you diagnose a patient, you don't do it using faith, you do it using years of experience/knowledge and tests.

Actually, medicine is a good example.  Yes, you do diagnose a patient from what you know - symptoms, signs, tests results, family history, lifestyle etc.  It all comes together to create a picture that you can interpret.  But whatever you diagnose, its always your best guess since you can never actually see from outside, the disease process going on.  You study the theories and you kinda imagine it in terms of things you've experienced and pictures you've seen.  (Yes I really do imagine the insides of people when I talk to them!)

So there's never gonna be absolute proof whether there is a god or not.  And if you're gonna assert something as abstract as an infinite entitiy, that we can't really even imagine with our 5 senses, then why even bother trying to prove it.

We would be pretty arrogant to think that our brains will eventually work out even 10% of how this universe really works.

All I'm saying is who knows you know?  Maybe after we die theres just a giant banana waiting, or maybe nothing at all.

I know what you're saying, why assert something as fact and then say believe what you like.  I think its like someone saying, hey, I'm warning you about whats coming.  Here's what I think is the absolute truth, but y'know find your own way through life.  If you agree with me, great, if not, fine...we'll see what happens.

I think the Quran is an interesting take on the nature of our reality.  Certain things in my life have led me to be inclined to think its true.  Things that could not have happened by chance.  They're personal things, so they would probably be meaningless to you if I told you.

Then I also think that the assertion that we are just here by chance is very unlikely.  A lot of things needed to happen in a certain way for us to exist.  The way the universe is feels so abstract and beautifully made, I cannot believe its all just chance.

And then as I said earlier, if you want to think about things logically - you can keep breaking the atom into quantum parts, but where does it end?  And if we eventually discover what contains our universe, what contains that and where does that end.  Logically there needs to be a absolute entity which contains it all.

They're all things that are just floating about in my head, what personally makes me interested in religion.  Of course none of it is fool proof.  Its just out there for discussion.

you do understand that we are extremely weak.

Yep.  In the grand scheme of things the Human race is just a blip.  We don't deserve a god, certainly not in our image.

why haven't you commented , you or vx, on that dialogue i wrote,

I haven't read it yet.  I will.

i mean you can't create something from nothing right??

This is circular logic.  Why is it that the Universe has to have been created but god always existed?  Why can't we say the Universe always existed in relation to time.  You can't have anything outside of time.  In order for god to have started time he must have existed within time.  Existence always existed because nothing can come from nothing.  God is unnecessary.  

so who created the big bang , ok who created  whetever tiny thing that made the universe ? who pushed that explosion ? how ?

I don't know.  Science has no answer for this.  I wouldn't assume it was a person or being of any kind.  Which in my eyes is a stretch of the imagination.  I personally believe the Universe works in a closed loop.  The Big Bang is only one instance of the Universe.  There were countless Big Bangs and when this Instance of the Universe dies a new one will form again.  This isn't my idea, it's a scientific theory.  Of course this doesn't answer how the loop came into existence but I don't like to think of Existence in terms of beginning and end.

it's beyond my human capacity.

It's not beyond our capacity, we just don't have a means to collect the data we need. 

Then I also think that the assertion that we are just here by chance is very unlikely.  A lot of things needed to happen in a certain way for us to exist.  The way the universe is feels so abstract and beautifully made, I cannot believe its all just chance.

Cause and Effect.  Nothing happens by chance.  It only feels this way when we can't perceive all the variables.  When I think about how unlikely it is that we are here, I remind myself of all the space and time where we are not there.  There's nearly an infinite chance for us to exist.  The vast vast majority of the time we do not exist at all.  Out of an immeasurable amount of time and hundreds of billions of light years of space, most of the time the human race is no where to be found.  It's only due to these exact conditions which we're allowed to exist.  Limited time only.  From our perspective we feel significant but we're not. 

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

Bastard! Bastarding bastardly bastards!!!

I was getting this for my birthday and now it's not going to happen.  He may have been a minority but the whole damn world can get itself to Afhganistan right now and send Arnie in to mop you all up!

Bastards!!!!

VX - great, now the extremists will be smashing their monitors and trying to kill everyone who posted in this thread because you posted a pic of Mohammed.

Bastards!!!!!!!!!!!

***flyingsaucersdisguisedasmushrooms***
***mushroomsinvadingfromouterspace***

Rational people do not get offended, ever. 

To never be offended is to place oneself under the false assumption that no act is ever objectively immoral.

"I'll wager sixty finest English pence that you defeat Big Sister in the end by shagging her to death."

Kikizo.com - Excellence in Journalism

To never be offended is to place oneself under the false assumption that no act is ever objectively immoral.

Just because something is offensive does not mean I need to be offended.  I find Christianity offensive, doesn't mean I'm offended because you call yourself a Christian.  I wouldn't even be offended if you call me a Christian.  I can be threatened, which is not the same thing as being offended.  Being offended implies that you somehow have the right to silence a person just because you don't agree.  It's a monumental sign of insecurity and arrogance. 

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

.....You christian.

Being offended, is (of many things) the first step in correcting human wrongdoing.

If people weren't offended by Apartheid, would it have changed? If people hadn't been offended by the Third Reich, would it have been stopped?

"I'll wager sixty finest English pence that you defeat Big Sister in the end by shagging her to death."

Kikizo.com - Excellence in Journalism

Eddie_the_Hated


Being offended, is (of many things) the first step in correcting human wrongdoing.

If people weren't offended by Apartheid, would it have changed? If people hadn't been offended by the Third Reich, would it have been stopped?

No one stopped the Third Reich out of doing whats right. Do you seriously believe that the governments of that time cared about the concentration camps? They cared about the very real possibility of Germany taking over all of Europe and then expanding even more.

And to Agent: lulz at the silly atheist

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Being offended, is (of many things) the first step in correcting human wrongdoing.

If people weren't offended by Apartheid, would it have changed? If people hadn't been offended by the Third Reich, would it have been stopped?

Those were clearly threats, they have nothing to do with being offended in the sense that these muslims were offended by the song.  No one has the right to impose their morals on other people.  They certainly don't have the right to violate free speech just because they don't like the fucking song.

It wasn't even a spoof, it was direct text from the Quran.  You'd think they'd be proud.

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

I heard the audio file posted on the front page and i have to say that it is an arabic sentence taken directly from Quran that people never used anywhere else. I am offended by this but in no means i plan or feel like killing/breaking a nose/hurting anyone who is a part of this mess. I wouldnt be offended if it was translated text or put in other words since then it would be plain talk and not Quran. I thank Sony and applaud them for respecting muslims feeling and taking action.

Those were clearly threats, they have nothing to do with being offended in the sense that these muslims were offended by the song.  No one has the right to impose their morals on other people.  They certainly don't have the right to violate free speech just because they don't like the fucking song.

It wasn't even a spoof, it was direct text from the Quran.  You'd think they'd be proud.

Agent, lets remember here that no-one actually told Sony to do this, Muslims didn't get offended and riot the streets - this time.  This was Sony's own internal decision, albeit arising only because of past history eg the teddy bear or the danish cartoon.

I dont think any Muslims would have been overly offended by this.

Gray, I gather the song was just a licensed track.  If you applaude Sony for taking it out of their game, do you feel the song shouldn't exist in the first place?  After all there are many songs quoting Quranic verses.

I think its just a song, someone elses artistic expression.  If I didn't agree with it I would just not listen to it.  If I didn't agree with it and still wanted to play LBP, maybe I would turn the music off during the swinging safari level.  To be honest, it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Cause and Effect.  Nothing happens by chance.  It only feels this way when we can't perceive all the variables.  When I think about how unlikely it is that we are here, I remind myself of all the space and time where we are not there.  There's nearly an infinite chance for us to exist.  The vast vast majority of the time we do not exist at all.  Out of an immeasurable amount of time and hundreds of billions of light years of space, most of the time the human race is no where to be found.  It's only due to these exact conditions which we're allowed to exist.  Limited time only.  From our perspective we feel significant but we're not.

I think cause and effect if left to its own devices, probably would not have led to where we are now.  To me, its like imagining the chances a car with no driver (and no futuristic GPS autopilot!) will drive forward making all the necessary turns in order for it to drive from California to New York by itself.  Sure there is an outside chance if the same process was attemted for millions of years - but its just improbable.

When considering how incredibly intricate and complicated even a fly or an ant is, or when you've studied the human body with all the intricate systems that keep us alive - I just can't believe its purely down to random cause and effect over millions of years.  Sure theres an outside chance, but the number of single improbable events that needed to happen to get to where we are, I just wonder what the actual figure would be - 10 to the power x?

If there was a God i would be able to have the Olsen twins. At the same time.

Agent, lets remember here that no-one actually told Sony to do this, Muslims didn't get offended and riot the streets - this time.  This was Sony's own internal decision, albeit arising only because of past history eg the teddy bear or the danish cartoon.

I'm not angry with muslims on this It's Sony that I have a beef with.  They overreacted.  I just found it incredibly stupid.  It's like compound stupidity.  I'm over it anyways.  Fable is putting me in a good mood, Fable 2 and SUSHI.  I may even buy LBP afterall. 

I think cause and effect if left to its own devices, probably would not have led to where we are now.  To me, its like imagining the chances a car with no driver (and no futuristic GPS autopilot!) will drive forward making all the necessary turns in order for it to drive from California to New York by itself.  Sure there is an outside chance if the same process was attemted for millions of years - but its just improbable.

When considering how incredibly intricate and complicated even a fly or an ant is, or when you've studied the human body with all the intricate systems that keep us alive - I just can't believe its purely down to random cause and effect over millions of years.  Sure theres an outside chance, but the number of single improbable events that needed to happen to get to where we are, I just wonder what the actual figure would be - 10 to the power x?

Cause and effect includes everything.  Even with a god he would have to fit into cause and effect.  I hope we can at least agree on this much.  Nothing is truly random.  Things can be practically unpredictable, that's not the same thing as random.  The idea of cause and effect is only saying that things don't happen without a cause.  Things don't pop out of nowhere.  The Universe is mathematical, every variable adds to one solution.  Everything is predictable with enough data.  Which of course is impossible.  The amount of data it takes just to predict the folding of proteins would blow your mind.  With 10 000 computers, in order to predict one nanosecond of a protein folding it would take 30 years.  That's just one atom in the Universe worth of data it would take in order to fully understand cause and effect.  Even if Randomness did exist, it would still have fixed effects.     

The complexity of life is explained fully with evolution.  It's a complete theory, science has our backs on this one.  Things don't randomly change.  They're called mutations.  Maybe chemicals, radiation or something damages DNA.  Most of the time DNA can fix itself during the gestation period.  However sometimes DNA does not repair itself correctly and the our DNA changes.  That's a mutation.  Everyone is born with mutations.  New DNA that neither parent has.  Many weird conditions and diseases are mutations that stayed in the gene pool.  I'm sure you already know this.  Sometimes a mutation is beneficial to survival or the act of breeding and thus becomes more popular. 

As for how you things become increasingly more complex even outside of life.  I like the Chaos theory.

Obviously this doesn't explain the origin of life.  Imo neither does the idea of a creator.  All it does is extend to question of how did we get here to how did god get here.  It's like a bad joke.

If there was a God i would be able to have the Olsen twins. At the same time.

That wouldn't be fair for the twins. 

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

DR evil, Mohammed (dedicaced to VX and the likes)
Fact 1: Mohamed is an analphabet , doesn't write doesn't read.

Fact 2: The revelation of the curan begun when he was 40 year old. (notice the age)

Fact 3: history shows that mohamed was a very respected man, trusty and extremely loyal.

How is this relevant?  I don't care about Mr. M.  Maybe he was a great guy maybe is he was just a really happy pedophile.  I don't care about historical figures.  If you want to make him your idol or mascot, I'm all for it.  I like the Terminator.  I'd love to have my own Terminator.  I wouldn't have to take any bullshit from anyone.  I could go to a bar and people would know me by name, people would let me pass in lines.  Having your own Terminator would be fucking handy.  What I dislike is the lies and fallocies in the Quran as well as the resulting behaviour of devote followers.  And thank the Terminators that most Muslims aren't devout followers.  The Quran has some nasty text in it.

Mohammed “ here I am a 40 years old fuck, sick of this trading job, sick of my family and sick of those rich bastards making money out of pagans, I should do something about that, this city is going down , I should restore some order, MY fucking order, I have traveled enough, seen places and read about religions ,  whoever created religion is a genius , I should come up with something similar and make a revolution, I know it doesn’t sound like me at all, but that’s the trick people will never ever guess that I can make up some bullshit like that …..   fuck I don’t know how to read and write, ooh what am I gonnaa do ? ooooh what am iii gonnna dooo ? i can probably hire a poet or a writer and split whatever we gain at first , then kill the bastard when we’re done …  or I can learn to read and write , should be easy at 40, specialy when I’m trying to write something godly and bunch of famous poets out there. Fuck I can still bribe them as well to shut their mouth.

I should go back to that cave and think deeply about this, and who is this poet who would sound godly and might fool billions of people from all times.

a)     Mohammed  never learned how to read and write. But may be that’s only what history says who knows what he could do.
b)   Mohammed created a cult, a secret order called the fraternity of the matrix, they are extremely secretive and only them could write the coran, ever , like fucking ever.

I’ll go with b for the sake of more stupidity

Mohamed talking to one of the poets:

_ So here is the thing, I need my first soura in a couple of months, that’s when the scheme will begin, make that the 27^th of Ramadan, that’s your deadline, make it or you’re dead. Now, I want you to make it sound as godly as you can, there are a lot of famous poets out there. I know we got bunch of them, but those fuckers are so many like the fucking goblins.
The poet is taking notes

_ Second, and listen up , I don’t want you to screw this because it’s one of my so many brightest smartest ideas. For every word "man"  and "woman" , paradise/ hell, good deed , wrong deed, angel/ demons, life / after life ( there are at leaaaaast 10 more  instances) , make them equals  in my book, for exemple if you write the word "woman" 30 times, writes "man" 30 times as well...  and you know what don't ever talk about it in the book, just put it there , i'm sur that centuries later, some retard will write that on a forum , probably kikizo. and put other numerical schemes like that

_ Splendid mohammed, you know I’m good at math, I’ll try to play with the number 19 a bit, should be fun , make some puzzles , you know ? make it mysteeerioooous .

_ about mysterious, put some weird bullshit, put a lot of them and I mean a lot, with enough chance people from the futur will discover something VERY similar to science and will think it's a sign.
_ Brilliant , I’ll do
_ also, we should keep this bullshit for 20 years , now don’t fucking die on me, don’t talk about it ever, i am sure for 20 years we can manage to hide that easily in this village, everbody is dumb,our wives wouldn't know certainly, our friends as well, nobody can know. I forsee the word “intelligence” will be created by the CIA and should begin to show in 20 th century, by the end of this  century,  people like “the VX”…
_ the “VX” you said ?
_ An animal from the atheist family that talks and can easily show everybody’s ignorance. This my friend is our worst enemy. But I would be dead anyway so who gives a fack.
_ Brilliant. Continue .
_ i should hire some historians ,
_ we don’t have money , remember ?
_ I’ll use your sister, I’m evil remember that ??,  they will write they were witness of some miracles, like angels fighting on the side of mujahidine , sound like lord of the ring ?
_ lord of what?
_a cloud casting shades on me whenever i go, and some other  bullshit like that, yeah probably some will not believe, but we only need the majority.
_ I’ll look into that.

_ make sure those historians write some great deed about me , that show how marvelous I am, how great and gentle , how I can raise armies even if I suck, how I can be an emperor from east to west, and don’t mention I’ll be so fucking rich, when I’m dead, write I was dead poor. make everything to the extreme, like I don’t make mistakes ever , eeever. I’m great and second to god.

_ fair enough, but how can we raise armies.

_ when they will believe our book, the best written thing ever created in Arabia, and I’m sure you can pull that off ….  We can also have another soura that promises 50 virgins, or 70 , no 71 virgins to sound accurate once in paradise. I’m sure those ugly bastards will fly to their swords and slice anything that’s on their way.

YEars later, Mohammed, Alias Dr evil , or pedophile to some people , have won hearts of noble men and women, fooled scientists of the time, surpassed the greatest poets and pulled out the greatest scheme that ever graced the earth.  …  Until The atheist Race is born to show light to humanity. Amen.

So are you saying the Quran is garbage?  I'm having a hard time understanding what you mean.  If this is what you're saying then what sources do you have for Islam?

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Science hasn't fully explained the exact path evolution has taken.  Its a sound theory of course and goes on in front of us today.  Changes in the size of a birds beak or the length of its wings etc.  Its the mutations which completely change life which astounds me.  There are missing fossil records to how things exactly happened, but there are some mutations that completely changed certain creatures.

For example, apparently birds evolved from reptiles.  And somewhere along the line some repiles' arms developed into wings and eventually learnt how to fly.  The theory is that a large change in genetic information happened by mutation, to alter the structure of their arms, provide a webbed surface, which eventually turned into a wing.  Its a little abstract and each change would have to have been advantageous to survival in order to pass on and not just die out.

Now I'm not saying this isn't possibly true, and I'm not disagreeing with the cause and effect principles.  Maybe its the romantic notion of it, but the idea of growing wings and flying seems even artistic.  Sure cause and effect is behind the process, but there's a sense that this process was directed in a creative way.

Our world didn't have to be this way, the laws of physics, time and space, the universe, planets with atmospheres and weather cycles, and animals that think - it all makes sense to us because we live here.  But things could have been different.  Who said logic ever had to exist?  Logic is a product of the laws of time and event.  Is time finite?  What's outside of time?

So cause and effect yes, but maybe only in our universe.  And as you said it doesn't explain origins, which is what makes me think that there needs to be something infinite to encompass it all.  That infinite entitiy is what I imagine 'god' to be - rather than an old bearded guy with a sick sense of humour that likes to create universes just to see what happens.

What really hurts my head is the question, why does anything need exist at all?


....LBP looks fun.

Actually, the artistic qualities of high level science is what appeals to many scientists. Many of the smartest physicists compare music and art to what they're doing. Because it holds some kind of "higher truth" in its best form.

And time will most likely be finite if the mass of the universe is over a certain point which will make it collapse under its own weight. It certainly had a beginning and changes speed depending on the speed you're traveling at.

Besides, cause and effect don't really exist at quantum level. Which is all the more fascinating since it is the basis for everything structured that we see. Although the chaos theory mentioned above kind of shows the underlying structure within chaos. It basically shows us that every system in balance is on the verge of chaos. But with the chaos actually following some sort of structure weird enough.

Speaking of weird stuff, time etc. There have even been experiments where they sent a laser beam higher than the speed of light through an aquarium and (a part of) the information included in the beam got out at the other side BEFORE it touched the nearest glass wall.

Many physicists at the highest level (even the atheists) have started to see some kind of "god" behind everything though. Well, as they said, call it whatever metaphor that you want but they've noticed that there is some kind of "blueprint" to everything. And some sort of underlying force pushing things towards certain states. Or it looks like it because they've seen that some things seem a bit too deliberate. 

Agent and VX , i'm gonna explain that dialogue and i'm really surprised how you both missed the point. my point is, that scenario cannot happen, i'm not talking about the content but i'm talking about its whole idea.  i was trying to think like you, because saying Mohamed is not a prophete is saying:

a) Mohamed is a liar.
b) the author's coran is human.

Now based on that i was trying to see how could both these assumptions happen . i ended up therefore with stupid dialogue that is far from being realistic. Everyone is off character. Therefore i urge you to explain me what could have happened back then. How mohammed pulled that off because if you really believe my dialogue could have happened then i regret but i cannot continue with this discution and choupolo should probably stop as well.

i want smart and OBJECTIVE answers but at the same time they should be reasonable considering mohamed is a human after all. you can't talk "shaekspear" suddently as you turn 40 ( and why 40 exactly ?), can you agent ? your answer would be , "well that's subjective, the writing style is subjective " ?well could he have impressed all those poets suddently and how could he wrote in the coran " even if you try to write something SIMILAR, you will not be able to ?? NOT EVEN A VERSE !", he impressed all humanity after him and not a single person, even after a 1400 years , could somebody write something like it , similar to it,  i don't know the coran by heart faaar from this, what i learnt  by heart is only its 3% may be but you can be sure , when i hear the coran I KNOW it is, because NONE is like it, yes people in some circunstances say a few sentences like the way it is said in the coran, but we know that these people took inspiration from the coran "  ( i didn't recognize it in LBP because he had a horrible accent mixed with the music, i didn't even know it's arabic, even though it's hardly a verse )

if indeed he was literate, how could he hide this fact from his surronding during all his life time  , a life time do you understand that ?? he had a life , a whole enviromeent surrounding him and history that affected him ?   why would he  write those words equaly trough a book of hundrends pages, YET nobody knew about this fact , UNTIL recently ",   is it like part of his conspiracy ??  could he be really that incredibly smart ???   or is it again  a "coincidence "  like you have explained the  creation of awhole universe ?   tell me agent tell me VX i neeed some answers.

Not only that but the word earth and word sea  have 33% and 77% occurences  in the book respectively which is how our planet is (earth / ocean).  remember there was an Aquality for many opposed word EXCEPT earth and sea , their ratio equals that of our planet.

how could he build that mosque in sanaa facing EXACTLY with a straight line mekah which is miles and miles away ( proved by google earth), he didn't even went there when the building took place, he gave them very precise coordinations. 1400 years later he was proved right , outstanding ! and maps that were 400 years after the prophet were completely off chart, go to youtube and check for yourself.

i need some answers goddamit , so who was he exaclty? i don't think you will believe NO matter what we say to you , and i have said the reasons and oh so many in my previous posts , they don't have to do with logic and math , they simply have to do with the education , your being and your pshycology . You are not ready for this. yes i said it !!

and to you westerners and your media, how come when somebody eat glass or pull a car with his teeth , you make sure everybody knows it , like it's the fucking greatest miracle ever, but when our prophet has been proven right ( in that LATEST exemple , google earth which everybody can check)  Nothing was said about it, i bet it should be at least judged "very interesting" . Of course you won't, certainly jews won't do it, atheists will say it's a coincidence and move on and christians won't make a high profile of their "competition"...

VX , agent , you will probably never believe no matter what unless may be jesus get resurrected, well even that won't cut it; you would calll him a mutant, a genetical change made that could make him do whatever miracle he will do, a la HEROES, or a slip from secret government experiences...  you will love that explnation, i bet you will.

Listen to the wise

Muhammad was a pedo, get over it.

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Is the Quran brilliant in Arabic?  I would put the English version at about high school level.  No where close to Shakespeare, seriously.

He was just wrong.  In those days people believed their own bullshit/ stupidities.  People believed the Earth being flat, some were executed for saying otherwise.  Humanity isn't that bright.  The further down history you go, the dumber they were.  Our records of history from this era are far from perfect.  People write what they want to write.  Nothing we have is reliable.  We can't even get reliable news coverage of something that happend last week in many cases.  I don't know how you can make specific scenarios of what happened. 

The idea that all of it is held by the notion that it was a fucking Angel that communicated with one man.  My theory is that he was a Schizophrenic if he wasn't lying flat out.  Schizophrenics tend to have extremely high IQs, inflated egos and they suffer from delusions and vivid hallucinations, they can see and interact with people that simply are not there at all.  If you were a schizophrenic all of Kikizo could be part of your hallucinations, you would never know.  You ever watch "Beautiful mind"?  There were many many crazies that claimed to be a Prophet, we still have some today.  Some are nuts, some are cheats.  You call them false Prophets, i say the same.  The only difference is that I call out one more than you.  That's my secondary theory. 

My primary theory is that Muhammad and friends knew that people were illiterate and easilly manipulated so he made up a nice bullshit story.  Religion and Philosophy were like politics back then.  If you can get enough people to belive your bullshit you can change policy.  Lets say that he was the lesser of evils and he promoted some good changes for the time.  So what?  Today we have better science to answer the questions of the Universe and a better understanding of morality and law.  Religion should be regarded as nothing more than a personal comfort and as a bookmark in history.

"This is sad. There's no other word for it. The person who invents a way to punch someone in the face over the Internet will make millions from the demand generated by people like this." Youtube comments

Agent Ghost

If there was a God i would be able to have the Olsen twins. At the same time.

That wouldn't be fair for the twins. 

Oh the stuff i would make them do...

Mmmm...

I wonder if anyone has ever called them "quadruplets" before. 

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I just got finished writing my letter to Santa. Since i've been such a good boy this year... the fat fuck better make damn sure he sends me both of them and not just one. I need two for what i want to do!

Seriously, it'd be the celebrity sex tape of all time.

They're trolls.

Joe Redifer


They're trolls.

Twins Joe... the word is twins.

And don't shit in my kettle, I like Mary-Kate and Ashley.

See thats what always confused me when people talk about them I always hear Mary...Kate... and Ashley as three separate names.  And yea maybe like Agent, I wonder what the fourth one is called.

Anyway aren't they still about 13 years old?

Joe Redifer


They're trolls.

No, a troll is someone who behaves like VF or KikizoTroll. Mary-Kate and Ashley used to be hot, then 1 of them became Skeletor and had to go to rehab for anorexia.

And that pic of the "Olsen Twins" isnt real, nitro. Its a shop.

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Anyway aren't they still about 13 years old?

Don't think so. I believe they're like 19 or maybe even 20. I'm positive that they're legal age considering they're on every celebrity magazine with bikini shots of their sexy bodies  boniness.

And yea maybe like Agent, I wonder what the fourth one is called.

LOL  That's not what I meant.  You're too innocent.

Don't think so. I believe they're like 19 or maybe even 20.

They're 22.  I remember that they're my age.

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Yeah, that picture is definitely 'shopped.

Agent Ghost

And yea maybe like Agent, I wonder what the fourth one is called.

LOL  That's not what I meant.  You're too innocent.

Bless...[

And fuck you Joe! That image is real. It was probably a Halloween party or something... where they explored each other for the first time... or something.

Nitro

Agent Ghost

And yea maybe like Agent, I wonder what the fourth one is called.

LOL  That's not what I meant.  You're too innocent.

Bless...[

And fuck you Joe! That image is real. It was probably a Halloween party or something... where they explored each other for the first time... or something.

Sorry, Nitro. But neither of their tits are that big, and 1 looks like skeletor now.

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.