Wii is bad for the industry

Gamespot inverview with Perry

GS: You mentioned the Wii as a disruptive innovation in the gaming industry, and Jamil drew a parallel to digital cameras essentially making old Polaroids all but obsolete. Do you think traditional games are actually going to be hurt by the Wii' s success?

DP: To carry the analogy forward, I think if Nintendo keeps innovating this way and nobody else does, it could spell doom and gloom for [those who don' t innovate]. They' re reacting. They' re not just sitting back. The concern was price as well. Prices were very high, but they' re realizing that and they' re trying to get the prices down. They' re also adding on more and more features, like the EyeToy, the Xbox Vision camera, that keyboard so you can type on the controller…

But nobody' s going to be able to respond to it this time around. The question is what happens next time around. Are they going to ignore [the Wii] like it never happened and just keep the arms race going? Or are they going to try to play the Nintendo game, which is to go for the mass market? That' s going to be where the answer happens. If Nintendo somehow keeps going in this direction--if they innovate yet again and surprise us all again--that could be bad. That could be very unhealthy for everybody else.

Gamesindustry Article!

As the Wii threatens to overtake the 360, what now for third-party publishers?

The vagaries of sales figure reporting across the world' s major territories make it quite hard to establish where, exactly, the tipping point lies - but it seems likely that at some point around now, Nintendo' s Wii will become (or has become) the top selling home console of the next generation.

It' s entirely possible that this lead will change hands a few times in the coming months, as games like Halo 3 drive a sales spike for the Xbox 360 - but the trajectory of the Wii' s sales curve suggests that even a moderately successful holiday season should bring it out comfortably on top when the bells ring on New Year' s Day.

Obviously, this is wonderful news for Nintendo - a firm which has gone from dominating the videogames industry to being seen as an innovative underdog, and suddenly finds itself on the path back to being the market leader. However, it' s also likely to lead to many tough questions being asked in the boardrooms of third-party publishers across the industry.

To put it bluntly, there are many people in third-party development and publishing who won' t be terribly happy to see Nintendo out in front. There is a perception in the industry that the success of a Nintendo platform is not necessarily followed by success for publishers who support that platform - and as a result, many would prefer to see the continued dominance of the PlayStation platform, which is perceived as more conducive to third-party success.

It' s not an entirely unfair view to hold. History relates that the most successful titles on Nintendo platforms are almost always Nintendo' s first-party products - a stark contrast to Sony' s ecosystem, where the biggest winners on the software front have traditionally been third-party publishers such as EA, Take Two and Square Enix.

It' s not just the headline titles that count, however - it' s the overall market share which is held by first-party titles. The huge success of brands such as Pokemon, Mario and Zelda have meant that in recent years, Nintendo' s platforms have been dominated by sales of its own games. The Wii is continuing this trend, with over half of all software sales on the platform being first-party.

Nintendo recognises this as a problem, with president Satoru Iwata telling Newsweek this week that he believes that third-party publishers want Nintendo' s share of the software market to drop to one-third.

Iwata reckons that next year, third-party software will be more prevalent on the Wii, taking with it the widely held perception that the firm is too powerful on its own platform. In the meanwhile, however, there' s a strong argument that this is a great problem for a firm like Nintendo to have.

The incredible success of the Wii console has been driven, and will continue to be driven, by first-party software. The most important titles in the future line-up for the system are almost exclusively first-party titles, and despite Iwata' s positive noises regarding the future of third-party software on the Wii, it' s likely that for the next 12 months at least, third-party game sales will largely be picked up in the wake left behind by the hugely successful first-party titles.

Nintendo, however, can hardly be blamed for making good games. Indeed, while publishers and developers may bite their bottom lips at the ongoing success of the Wii, the simple fact is that this is a challenge which they must knuckle down and meet head-on.

Nintendo is turning up to the party with millions of consumers and a platform which is almost uniquely cheap to develop for. The opportunity to make money is very clear, and the signs all suggest that Nintendo' s targets for the platform (16.5 million units sold by March 2008) are likely to be limited by the firm' s ability to manufacture consoles fast enough, not by demand. No publisher can afford to ignore the platform.

However, success on the Wii will require something many publishers aren' t very good at - innovation, and its attendant partner, risk. Developing products for the Wii is cheap, no more expensive than developing for the PS2. However, it is risky, because the console demands new styles of gameplay, new types of user interaction, and new forms of content that appeal to an audience more diverse than those found on other console platforms.

As such, it is only to be expected that the Wii will be home to some high-profile failures as well as high-profile successes. Many publishers have become experts at avoiding risk on conventional console platforms, but those strategies will prove ineffective on the Wii - where a low-risk strategy of multi-platform porting and focusing on franchise sequels is likely to be a commercial disaster.

The Wii' s success is undeniable - but for third party publishers, the challenge posed by the console is equally clear. The gauntlet is on the floor; it' s not up to Nintendo to haul third-party firms up by the lapels. Rather, it is up to the third parties to demonstrate that they, too, can deliver innovation and fresh content. If Nintendo' s market share of Wii software remains this high next year, it' s important to remember that it is the third parties, not Nintendo, who will have failed to rise to the opportunity before them.

Two different views of what the Wii means for the industry. Both arent entirely positiv, though it might just be the fear of change, but if going going for a mass market approach means going after the lowest possible demeanor, then im not for it.

Keeping the cost down and thus making the console weaker, will provide incentive for me to change back to PC gaming for a highpowered visuals A.I and physics. The PS3 and 360 deliver somewhat of what the PC does at 25% the cost, making it more affordable than a reasonable game PC.

Well the GI article raises a few good points (some of which i' ve already tried to explain to the Nintendo nubs here, but hey, what do i know eh!?) but Dave Perry hasn' t put out a decent game since MDK, and that was a decade ago.

I can' t see how the Wii can be bad for the whole industry.
It' s bad for Nintendo fans who want next-gen versions of Nintendos franchises and their entertaining gameplay.
But the whole industry won' t be hurt by it. Hardcore gamers are still the biggest group so developers will still focus on them. The only difference is that they can make an extra $ on all the casual and non-gamers via the Wii.

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Bollocks.. (at the thread, not ur comments Gin..lol)


The main two reasons why 3rd devs would ever moan about the Wii:


1: Power

Wii' s not powerful enough for them to make another version of GRAW2, GEARS or COD4 ECT.

2: Working with less and coming up with more (Creative will)

Not creative enough or not in the same frame-mind as Nintendo, or other Devs when it comes to making creative games and coming up with new ideas that are good ones.. Too busy trying to create PC type experinces as opposed to ' Home console' ones.


This is why you' ll see the More creative devs like: Konami, Capcom, SEGA, Temco ect only Praise the Machine and its controller and direction.

Aslo as gin kinda stated, Bringing in Masses of new Gamers is Only good for the industry.

Currently playing:
Korg DS 10 (ds) /  Metal Slug 7 (ds)
Rhythm Heaven (ds) /  Fire Emblem (ds)
Super Stardust HD (psn) /  Virtua Fighter 5 (360)
FSX (P

I think the biggest point they have is that 3rd party developers will see less profit when a Nintendo console is dominating the market since Nintendo' s games always steals all the sales from everything else.
BUT I have a logical explantation for that: 3rd party titles on nintendo consoles always suck! Did the Gamecube have GTA? Tekken? Virtua Fighter? Okami? Shenmue? Final Fantasy XII? Knights of the old republic? Doom 3? No, they only got shit.
And the second reason is that traditionally Nintendo consoles have been bought by Nintendo fans and kids. That makes it more likely that Nintendos software will sell better.
BUT, the Wii is bought by more than just Nintendo fans and kids which means that the potential to sell good 3rd party titles is dramatically increased.

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Bollocks.. (at the thread, not ur comments Gin..lol)


The main two reasons why 3rd devs would ever moan about the Wii:


1: Power

Wii' s not powerful enough for them to make another version of GRAW2, GEARS or COD4 ECT.

2: Working with less and coming up with more (Creative will)

Not creative enough or not in the same frame-mind as Nintendo, or other Devs when it comes to making creative games and coming up with new ideas that are good ones.. Too busy trying to create PC type experinces as opposed to ' Home console' ones.


This is why you' ll see the More creative devs like: Konami, Capcom, SEGA, Temco ect only Praise the Machine and its controller and direction.

Aslo as gin kinda stated, Bringing in Masses of new Gamers is Only good for the industry.

I know your the holy protector of the Wii, but if only creative will is to drive a console, why not just release a system powered with a mega drive or something.

There is more to innovation than just making up new things. And some of those require power, if you take one step backwards and one step forward you end up right where you started.

You mention some " creative" companies praising the console, but we have yet to see a single 3rd party wii game worth considering.

As stated by gamesindustry, there is a considerate risk producing " different" games, since it might as well backfire if not done probably, this raises costs which isnt good for alot of the mainstream games.

Its hard to make games for the wii since the controller is limited in other ways than a standard device, and in some ways more capable.

In anycase its bad if the Wii means that next gen will have lower price consoles at the cost of console power, its a turn for the worse.

There is more to innovation than just making up new things. And some of those require power, if you take one step backwards and one step forward you end up right where you started.

When the 360 and the PS3 has shown a title with gameplay that far surpases the last generation I will submit to your wisdom. So far, next-gen games have had current-gen gameplay. With a few improvements of course like more advanced physics, but nothing that has evolved or vastly improved the gameplay to an extent that the power gives creative force an advantage.

You mention some " creative" companies praising the console, but we have yet to see a single 3rd party wii game worth considering.

That problem isn' t related to the hardware, it' s mor related to the lazyness of the developers and their focus on making quick n' easy money on ports and crap titles. Besides, the Wii hasn' t been around for that long. It wasn' t until Gears that the 360 had anything to brag about.

As stated by gamesindustry, there is a considerate risk producing " different" games, since it might as well backfire if not done probably, this raises costs which isnt good for alot of the mainstream games.

That risk is always present regardless if you develop games for the Wii or any other console. I for one am glad that developers try to do " different" things. Since the audience of the Wii will be more open for new ideas since the whole Wii image is based on such thoughts, I think that the risk of failure for a " different" title is even less than on other consoles.

Its hard to make games for the wii since the controller is limited in other ways than a standard device, and in some ways more capable.

Correction: It' s hard to make STANDARD games for the Wii. Developers has to realise that you can' t just make the same gameplay but with a different controller. Gameplay has to change from the core. That' s why we' ve seen so many crap games on the Wii. They haven' t changed anything, they just replaced the controller buttons which is far from Nintendos vision of games on the Wii.

In anycase its bad if the Wii means that next gen will have lower price consoles at the cost of console power, its a turn for the worse.

This generation we have the 360 and the PS3 and those consoles cater to their respective target groups. In the next generation, Nintendo will probably have to catch up.
But as I said, so far the power of the 360 and the PS3 hasn' t provided any major changes in gameplay and as such, games still remain as fun as they' ve always been. As long as games are fun, who cares? If the purpose of videogames are achieved then power, controllers or brands don' t mean shit. If videogames on the Wii are fun, who cares about power?

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Two thirds of 360 game sales are by third party games. Two thirds of Wii game sales are by first party games. Factor in the software attach ratios and go figure which is more appealing to third parties...

ORIGINAL: Nitro

Two thirds of 360 game sales are by third party games. Two thirds of Wii game sales are by first party games. Factor in the software attach ratios and go figure which is more appealing to third parties...

Three thirds of Wii 3rd party games are CRAP! If they made good games and invested some time and money on them instead of making quick crap titles and ports then I promise you we' d see better results for 3rd party developers.

As a Gamecube owner I know how it works. I didn' t buy any 3rd party titles for the Gamecube. But was it because Nintendo' s games are better than 3rd party games? F*** NO! It was because the 3rd parties never made any good games for the GCN. All their good efforts went to the Xbox and the PS2.
I would' ve bought tons of 3rd party titles for the GCN if there had been any worth my time and money.

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

When the 360 and the PS3 has shown a title with gameplay that far surpases the last generation I will submit to your wisdom. So far, next-gen games have had current-gen gameplay. With a few improvements of course like more advanced physics, but nothing that has evolved or vastly improved the gameplay to an extent that the power gives creative force an advantage.

Which game last gen surpassed everything that was done prior to that?

ORIGINAL: ginjirou

Three thirds of Wii 3rd party games are CRAP! If they made good games and invested some time and money on them instead of making quick crap titles and ports then I promise you we' d see better results for 3rd party developers.

And the reasons they haven' t are stated quite clearly in the GI article VX linked to. They' re considered risky. It' s the same with DS and the only titles that have come anywhere near the kind of sales Nintendo' s own games have enjoyed are the Final Fantasy remakes. Most DS games are trash and it' ll be the same for Wii.

Nintendo don' t need to do shit because they' re making millions on software sales which are the backbone of this industry and third parties know they can' t compete with Nintendo' s dominance on it' s own platform, which is why Iwata said he realized publishers want Nintendo share of the consoles software market to drop to a third.

Third parties have to figure out who they' re targeting and adapt their games accordingly, and since Wii' s install base is far more casual, they' ll have to create more casual games. What happens then is we lose out because shit like Brain Training just ain' t my bag baby.

The GI article echoes exactly what i said months ago.

Which game last gen surpassed everything that was done prior to that?

Not many. But the few who did surpass the games before them did so thanks to gameplay enhancements affected by creative ideas, not by the power. Power can only tweak games and make them look prettier.
But the awesome core gameplay comes from great ideas and the true beauty comes from great art work.
If there had been no 360 or PS3 or Wii, we would' ve seen games on the PS2, GCN and Xbox that just got better, and better and better even if the hardware remained as weak as it was, because the ideas would still improve and for each title that is released developers would learn new things and improve on past efforts.

Power only fixes the tiny corners of a much larger picture. A picture made of ideas unlimited by hardware, limited only by one' s imagination.

(I should be a spokesman for the Wii, seriously! )

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Most DS games are trash and it' ll be the same for Wii.

If you compare the good games/bad games ratio on a console like the PS2, you' ll see the same result. Huge amount of bad games isn' t related to the hardware, it' s related to the developers trying to make money on cheap crap.
The DS has a good amount of great games. Games that justifies the features of the DS

Third parties have to figure out who they' re targeting and adapt their games accordingly, and since Wii' s install base is far more casual, they' ll have to create more casual games. What happens then is we lose out because shit like Brain Training just ain' t my bag baby.

That' s the only argument that I can agree with. More casual people among Wii owners means more focus on games of their like from 3rd party developers.
But around 10 million Wii units have been sold. Far from half of them are probably casual gamers. That means there are still millions of hardcore players, more than that of the PS3, that long for hardcore games. That' s a huge amount of potential profit for a 3rd party developer and as such I expect 3rd party developers to keep creating hardcore games.
As the amount of titles on the Wii increases, so will the hardcore gamers and so will the focus on games of their like.
That is, if everything proceeds as it should. But this is the dark and terrible reality so maybe everything will go to hell just like everything else in this godamn cursed world!

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Not many. But the few who did surpass the games before them did so thanks to gameplay enhancements affected by creative ideas, not by the power. Power can only tweak games and make them look prettier.
But the awesome core gameplay comes form great ideas and the true beauty comes from great art work.
If there had been no 360 or PS3 or Wii, we would' ve seen games on the PS2, GCN and Xbox that just got better, and better and better even if the hardware remained as weak as it was, because the ideas would still improve and for each title that is released developers would learn new things and improve on past efforts.

Power only fixes the tiny corners of a much larger picture. A picture made of ideas unlimited by hardware, limited by only ones imagination.

But the creativity that was in the last generation is not totally reset upon a new one.

This way we are getting prettier games that can offer expansive enviroments, more details, better more potential for A.I.

Those werent possible in the same degree in the last gen, you could create a great variety of games, but nothing in the 360 or PS3 is hindering that.

The Wii is more limited that the other consoles IMO

I' m not saying power is a limiting factor. Of course power is a good thing. You can NEVER have too much power. I' m just saying that just because the Wii lacks the kind of power the other two consoles have it doesn' t mean it' s worthless.

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Playing = Believing

I' m not saying power is a limiting factor. Of course power is a good thing. You can NEVER have too much power. I' m just saying that just because the Wii lacks the kind of power the other two consoles have it doesn' t mean it' s worthless.

Well then you arent getting the point, What if the Wii means less power to lower costs in the forthcoming next next gen!

Well then you arent getting the point, What if the Wii means less power to lower costs in the forthcoming next next gen!

And you' re missing MY point. If gameplay is still awesomely fun and entertaining even without extra power, does it really matter if we' ll see a slower progress in processing power?


But whatever, why would the Wii mean less power in the future?
We are talking about two different segments of the audience here.

Some people, like you, would NEVER buy anything that' s weaker than the latest shit on the hardware front.

Some people, like Virtua Fighter, would NEVER buy anything that doesn' t enhance or simplifies past forms of entertainment.

And some people, like me, prefer two have both things.

Both powerful AND weak consoles have their target groups, their guarantied profits and their guarantied quality. If the products become good or not, is up to the manufacturers and how well the developers utilize the potential offered.
You can be sure that powerful consoles will always be profitable enough to motivate their existence. As such, your needs will always be satisfied.
The Wii simply tries to satisfy the needs of other people. A part of the market that has been ignored for quite a while. It does not try to compete with your needs, even though it tries to satisfy those as well.

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Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Once again you miss the point!

It' s reasonable to think that MS and Sony will copy some of nintendos buisness plan and thus make slower cheaper consoles next time around.

I want games to be fun, its the primary goal of them. But as it is now PS3 and 360 games are more fun than those on the Wii, partly because the look of them is dated, its like slapping on an old game but without the nostalgia to keep it good.

I do own a wii, and ill play the main titles for it, though im dreading how Mario Kart is going to be, i imagine its going to be awful with the wii stick

It' s reasonable to think that MS and Sony will copy some of nintendos buisness plan and thus make slower cheaper consoles next time around.

No that' s not reasonable. There are millions of people who demand the most powerful hardware possible on a new console. You' re one of them, one of millions of potential buyers of a new console. Do you really think MS or Sony would give up all those millions of people just for the profits they can get from casual gamers who buy like, five titles a year? Not a chance! They' ll never give up on you because you' re too profitable.
Let' s say MS wants to go the Nintendo way and release a weak console. Then Sony would have the chance of their life to make an uber-powerful consoles that beats Microsofts console by far. Then millions would ONLY buy Sony' s consoles for that single reason. MS would never allow that.
This occurence with a weak console will only work THIS generation. Next generation innovation AND power will be required if the companies want to keep a reasonable amount of the marketshare.

I want games to be fun, its the primary goal of them. But as it is now PS3 and 360 games are more fun than those on the Wii, partly because the look of them is dated, its like slapping on an old game but without the nostalgia to keep it good.

Well, comparing current games available I' d also say 360 and PS3 games are more fun. But in time I expect this to change, at least for me. Perhaps not for you but I think you' ll find titles that you will enjoy.
In comparison I do find more PSP, PS2, GCN, Xbox and DS games that are fun than games on the PS3 and the 360. So it' s not related to the power in my case.

I do own a wii, and ill play the main titles for it, though im dreading how Mario Kart is going to be, i imagine its going to be awful with the wii stick

i never liked Mario Kart in the first place. I' m more interested in F-Zero and I see huge potential in the Wii-mote for that franchise. But they have to keep the precision and sense of speed from previous games or it' ll be worthless.

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Nintendo
Playing = Believing

Your guess is as good as mine, part of Nintendos success is markating it as a cheap family console.

I hardly think they will shy away from that approach next generation. And if the 3rd party devs then start supporting the major weak console, then we back at square one, fewer good games on the powerful consoles.

though there will be good games on something that should have been released 5 years ago.

I dont know, after playing in high defination, the wii simply looks bad.

Doubt it. Even though most major 3rd party devs would support the " weakling" millions would still buy the powerful consoles simply because of their power. Those millions of people alone are enough to motivate 3rd party developers to keep creating games for the powerful consoles. Of course, developers would still want to create games for both console types as it would increase profits.
But anyway, I don' t think the price of the Wii is a major factor. I think it' s the controller. If all three manufacturers have inovative controllers next generation, then they' ll have to play the power card in order to compete.
But that' s IF (and that' s a major if) the Wii can keep satisfying the Wii owners.
I imagine that once non-gamers and casual gamers have gotten a taste of the Wii, they' d like to try out the PS3 and the 360 as well since they' ve gotten introduced to the concept of gaming.

But whatever, maybe you' re right, maybe the whole industry is fucked and the Wii is wolf in disguise. Who knows. At least I' ll have fun with it

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

I don' t think the price of the Wii is a major factor. I think it' s the controller. If all three manufacturers have inovative controllers next generation, then they' ll have to play the power card in order to compete.

Yeah the Wii mote is also the reason, but if it cost 600$ it wouldnt sell like hot cakes.

The wii is marketed as being fun to play on, not that it has great games, there the difference.

Wii look at me, im swinging my arms like a freakin lunatic, im having fun though the game is bad, look at mii, haha!

If all companies try having controllers akin to the wii mote next gen, ill definetly be getting into PC gaming.

Imagine playing Ninja Gaiden with a Wii mote, it should have been a periphial!

Coming back from Omega lan event and Seeing a 360 Room with 3 people playing COD4 then walking through the packed PC room into the even more Packed Wii-party Room with about 30+ gamers of all age, Sex having a Toruney of Wii Sports Really sums everything up TBH.

Chill the *** out. Have a laff or leave it be, simple as.. Cos theres plenty out thier who enjoy and buy the thing anyway.

Currently playing:
Korg DS 10 (ds) /  Metal Slug 7 (ds)
Rhythm Heaven (ds) /  Fire Emblem (ds)
Super Stardust HD (psn) /  Virtua Fighter 5 (360)
FSX (P

Sex having a Toruney of Wii Sports Really sums everything up TBH.

They had sex?

So you think they will be playing Wii Sports for many hours of gaming, if a person can stand playing 20 hours of Wii sports, they need to have their heads examined, its fun for a brief burst of time, but thank god its a free game!

Chill the *** out. Have a laff or leave it be, simple as.. Cos theres plenty out thier who enjoy and buy the thing anyway.

'
Hey if you dont like the thread! Get the fuck out!

If I had 30 people over at my house you can bet your ass on that I' d be playing Wii sports or similar. Playing DOD4 in such a crowd would just be distracting.
But would I be playing Wii sports if I wanted to play for myself or if I just had one or two buddies over at my place? F*** no!
The consoles and game types are suited for different situations.

VX, I think he means gender when he says sex, although I' m not sure

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

VX, I think he means gender when he says sex, although I' m not sure

Ohhh what are girls doing at a Lan, thats fucking scary ! If girls are geeky enough to go to a lan...... I dare not think the thought!

So you' re saying that you did believe he meant sexual intercourse but didn' t get the idea of girls at a LAN party when he said

Sex having a Toruney of Wii Sports Really sums everything up TBH.

?

That means you thought he meant GUYS were having sex at a LAN party..


mmmpffff, pfff, BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Wii DSLite
Nintendo
Playing = Believing

lol, don' t tell me VX your one of the Those People who Fill in the part of an Application that asks for your sex, with

' Yes Please' ..

Currently playing:
Korg DS 10 (ds) /  Metal Slug 7 (ds)
Rhythm Heaven (ds) /  Fire Emblem (ds)
Super Stardust HD (psn) /  Virtua Fighter 5 (360)
FSX (P

lol, don' t tell me VX your one of the Those People who Fill in the part of an Application that asks for your sex, with

' Yes Please' ..

What? thats not what they mean?

Divides the market, thats for sure. Bad? it' s doing alot more good than Bad.

Hardware has not much to do with it either, If Wii was as powerful as 360 or PS3, Nintendo' s games would show-up 3rd parties Even more.

Too bad that didnt happen. Pics or not true.

I dont want to celebrate, I want to sell you hate.

Which game last gen surpassed everything that was done prior to that?

For me personally it was Shenmue. It was epic in its scope, NPC' s had their own routines and lives. All of them had a voice too instead of the standard scrolling text in RPG' s. Besides that there were hundreds of different NPC' s. There was also an arcade hall with classic playable games, you could buy things from stores, the main character actually opened doors, walked on stairs, dialed a phone correctly. The camera adapted itself dynamically during conversations, there were QTE' s and there also was a fighting engine with reasonable depth,...

I hadn' t seen a game with so many different features like that one before. To be honest, not after it either ;)

2: Working with less and coming up with more (Creative will)

Not creative enough or not in the same frame-mind as Nintendo, or other Devs when it comes to making creative games and coming up with new ideas that are good ones.. Too busy trying to create PC type experinces as opposed to ' Home console' ones.


This is why you' ll see the More creative devs like: Konami, Capcom, SEGA, Temco ect only Praise the Machine and its controller and direction.

Aslo as gin kinda stated, Bringing in Masses of new Gamers is Only good for the industry.

That' s faulty logic. If " less" is more then imagine how much more " more" is. In no way are PS3 or 360 impaired for supporting creativity. Certainly not because the hardware is more capable.

At best, you could say that Nintendo is more creative than any other developer and no other platform has Nintendo games. Nintendo isn' t the most creative developer, but if you must have Nintendo games one could make a case for Wii.

Wii would still be a piece of shit though.

If everyone is buying the last gen platform, developers will have smaller budgets for making great games on capable platforms. Wii is effectively pulling the industry back 5 years, or at least creating drag.

For me personally it was Shenmue. It was epic in its scope, NPC' s had their own routines and lives. All of them had a voice too instead of the standard scrolling text in RPG' s. Besides that there were hundreds of different NPC' s. There was also an arcade hall with classic playable games, you could buy things from stores, the main character actually opened doors, walked on stairs, dialed a phone correctly. The camera adapted itself dynamically during conversations, there were QTE' s and there also was a fighting engine with reasonable depth,...

I hadn' t seen a game with so many different features like that one before. To be honest, not after it either ;)

Actually the game outcast was just as epic in its scope, featuring huge wide open spaces and daily rutines for its inhabitants.

Though Shenmue and Outcast were both ahead of their time an even more advanced game could be created on the 360 and the PS3, and not the Wii. The wii should only feature abstract and cartony games games like Mario and Zelda, everything wanting to look real will just be an abomination.

They had sex?

Old women screwing 5 year olds?

Hardware sale are only a piece of the puzzle here. The real money in the gaming industry comes from, well, games.

Take a look at the software numbers.

360 is currently moving more software than Wii and PS3 combined. Does anyone really belive this fact has been lost on developers? 360 has combined respectable marketshare with a hardcore userbase. Wii has an industry high marketshare but a casual audience that will only buy 2-3 games a year. I' d rather be in Microsoft' s shoes. With revenue streams from LIVE subscriptions, arcade micro-transactions and traditional game sales they have the most diversified strategy and they did it without abandoning the Hardcore. Wii' s hardware success has not changed the fact that blockbuster games are almost always developed with the hardcore in mind. Anybody that touts Wii Sports as a casual games blockbuster, give your head a shake, that game would go nowhere if it didn' t include an extra Wii-mote.


Yes, Nintendo has chosen to abandon the hardcore. Before the Nintendo fanboys flame me to death, I own all three systems. I hardly ever play with the Wii. Why? Because the games look like so much fecal matter on my HD TV next to Gears, Bioshock, Ninja Gaiden Sigma etc.. Graphics aren' t everything, it' s true but they' re not nothing either are they?

In the long run Wii will get buried by HD game sales. Is it bad for the industry? Absolutely NOT. Anything that introduces gaming to a wider audience and helps shed the stigma around gaming in North America (I can' t speak intelligently of european gaming) is good for the industry.

What is bad for the industry is SONY' s stumbling launch year and seeming inability to compete with Microsoft war chest of cash. Where are your exclusives SONY? Remind me why I dropped $550 (canadian) on your blu-ray player? The best thing I' ve got for my PS3 is the BBC documentry Planet Earth on Blu-Ray. Ninja Gaiden is great but I already beat it on Xbox. If SONY can' t pick up the slack than we have Microsoft dominating and any company with a near monopoly is bad news for the competitve spirit.

edited: for spelling errors

Anybody that touts Wii Sports as a casual games blockbuster, give your head a shake, that game would go nowhere if it didn' t include an extra Wii-mote.

The game comes with the Wii console, not a Wiimote. As soon as the casual see other people playing Tennis and bowling, it was a casual Hit. It' s Unique and easily the most accessible game to date. This is why it' s a winner.


360 doing the worst for gaming IMO as it' s drawing people away from playing at home with each other. Too much thought on online play and not interacting directly with people. Good job Wii is here to counter that.

Also, Too many Xbox FPS' s kids growing up not knowing anything else but FPS after FPS. Has 360 actually got a good original game? PS3 aims well with Littlebigplannet, Wii is built for original games of course but im not seing anything for 360 in this direction. Ultimately i feel Microsoft will loose bigtime if they continue to concentrate on Hardcore FPS. It' s turning into a Poor mans PC and nothing Else.

It' s Wii Play that comes with the Wiimote, not Wii Sport...

Has the 360 got any original titles......Table tennis, Viva Pinata. There you go 2 for starters.

Wii sports is not a hit, it is a give away, it is included with the console, not everyone likes Wii sports who had it forced on them.

Face it the Wii is not a serious gaming machine, the sameway a ZX Spectrum or a Commodore 64 wasn' t a serious PC. The Wii is a bit of fun, that can be enjoyed by everyone of all ages, however until it has titles of substance and quality it will be seen as a gimmick, is that bad for the gaming industry? Who knows at the moment it is bringing people and money into the industry and if that inturn brings about a diversity in the type of games that are played, then it is a good thing, the only thing that needs to be watched is the quality, if people will accept anyone old rubbish from devs, then the industry will suffer.

gamer4eva I can' t see your point on this one. Just because 360 got online play it doesn' t mean people stop going out. It' s a bit like you' d say people stop talking and meeting each other in person cause there are IM' s. Playing online is no replacement for 4 people and a couple of beers at a friends house, but it' s still fun. And actually I doubt that anybody stopped going over to his friends house because there is online play. It' s not a replacement for the way you interact with your gaming friends, it' s just another way.

And what exactly did Wii to counter this? They completely bricked online gimping, wow. And actually I absolutely can' t see your point. I never had any friends come over to play some Wii Sports with me. The only time people play mah Wii is when I am giving a party or some kids are visiting my family. If I just owned a Wii I actually doubt that people would even visit me for the sole purpose for gaming (And it will stay that way until SSBB und Mario Kart Wii get released). On the other hand I have regular meet ups with my friends to play Xbox.