I actually like how this debate has kind of come to even ground. Agent, I actually feel you have much more reason in your view because if life is finite you can see it for what it is. Vx, not to point you out but your view when you talk about experiences and such, you aren' t truly representing your own view of a finite death. You are trying to give life a meaning through society and experiences as a religious person does with religion. " A rose by any other name is still a rose."

Most definetly not!

The big difference is you believe in a god!

I dont have a problem with society, laws, rules, regulations. They have been set by men, by something thats real.

Now the laws in the bible have been set by men as well, but the big difference is that people say they are some higher powers laws.

I dont see the point in following rules that will yield you nothing, you want get punished, or anything by following them.

So yeah, i do give my life meaning, and that is the only true meaning of life. Life is what you make of it.

How does other religions fit into your view Rampage? Allah? Buda? Thor? Zeus? are they just as real as god.

As i said before Jesus already died for your Sins so go knock yourselves out boys, there aint no way you are going to hell

Well, it was all man-written. Everything in the Bible was written by men, over the course of thousands of years ago, so, the earlier being the Old Testament. So, why am I not Jewish? Simple.

I like the idea of bacon and condoms.

You' re just picking what you like and ditching the rest. You want to know why you like condoms and bacon? Because your parents aren' t Jewish. Like majik was insinuating, we' re a product of our environment. If you were from a different time/place you' d believe in a different god. When a society dies so does the myth.
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=ahWFiaGATnY
Many of these dieties have characteristics that contradict that of others.

Ok. If you really want to, why not?

So, my first question, do you believe that any of the words of Jesus, not necessarily in their entirety, have some sort of value to a civilized society? There are plenty of atheists who, while not agreeing with his divinity, agree that Jesus existed, and wasn' t a liar, a nutjob, or a con-man. Are you one of them?

I believe that Jesus was one of many self proclaimed Massiahs in his time. He was a successful mascot for his cult, nothing more. He borrowed a lot of ideas that outdated him by hundreds of years. Nothing he said that made sense was original. Cults are made probably on a daily basis, Scientology is a cult. We laugh at it because we see how plainly stupid it is. The reason a religion like christianity gets respect is due to the history and culture attached to it. To an atheist, Christianity is no more logical than Scientology. Give me one shred of evidence to support Christianity over Scientology.

Stalin did alright for his time.

Sorry, I was talking about American politicians when I said politicians don' t stand a chance unless they' re a christian with a family. I was talking about the voters.

Huckabee is a tool.

At least he' s honest about being a tool. The other one' s are mearly pretending.

You talk about the financial corruption present in religion. Let' s see some numbers.

Why would I have any numbers? Go to Rome and look at the churches there. They have buildings everywhere on the globe. Any Corporation with buildings spread out globally has money. ***ing McDonald' s, they' re an Empire.

If our purpose in life is merely to survive, why do we have cognitive ability so much greater than the organisms around us?

Evolution. We evolved from apes that lived in trees. The trees dissapeard due to environmental changes and the apes had to become hunter and gatherers. Circumstances promoted competition and the apes with the most intelligent were given the advantage to procreate. We simply were not physically adapted to the new environment. Our distant ancestors didn' t have claws or the ability to run fast. They had thumbs and sticks. Snowball effect. Even today, the most intelligent have an advantage.

abstinence.

Fair enough if you want to avoid having a child. Notice I never mentioned you, a 16 year old probably shouldn' t be ***ing around anyways. But that' s not he real reason is it (Rampage)?

If there' s any other reason then fine, it' s his life. But I think he mentioned he had to get married first. That' s just sad. Even if you believe in god, I can tell you right now. God doesn' t give a shit if you get married before sex or not. Why would god want to control a human being. Would we want to control an ant? If there was a god it would not even notice the human race, that' s how unimportant we are in the grand scheme of things.

What if you' re wrong.

Well as Majik said, Hell does sound a like a better party. More importantly, did you know that originally in Christian doctrin there was no Hell? They originally said an atheist and sinners have no soul and thus when they die they cease to exist just as an athiest expects anyways. This wasn' t frightening enough so they added Hell in a revision. So I' m going with the original story and assume that I have no soul. Either way it makes no difference for me.

But logic and respect means nothing in the end.
But you already know survival is futile and meaningless.

Yep, doesn' t mean I' m not right. It' s all relative. I never said we should care about survival, I was mearly describing the engine that drives life. I' m not saying I have an ultimate answer either, I' m just saying we' re here. An atheist doesn' t need to answer why.

Really, if your views are correct, my religion isn' t doing anything to hinder me or anyone else. It' s just a way to cope and pass time. In the end it all means nothing if death is finite anyway so there' s really no argument.

Asimov said something to the effect that it' s illogical for an atheist to argue over religion. Same reasoning you just used. It' s true, we have no good reason to care. I' m just killing time. That being said, I' m not going to let you use that as an argument. You support big claims explaining existance and providing purpose and even guidlines for behaviour. I' m saying you owe me big evidence.

Vx, actually I' m most definitely correct. How does believing in a God have anything to do with it? Nothing, you are still being a follower. It' s the action that defines it. Society, rules, laws, regulations, are man made but they aren' t real. They are as real as God if he doesn' t exist. Show me society. You' d probably say look all around... I' d say the same thing if I were saying where to look for God.

All your laws and regulations have no meaning. Just what you give it. You are coping by accepting them. None of them mean anything when you die so why should they matter in life.

Life is what you make of it, but that' s just an illusion in your case. It' s all just a way to wait for your death, passing time as Agent said. That' s all you are doing. So what if I believe some guy in the sky created everything, is going to grant me eternal life if I live up to his standards. Tell me how my life and actions are so different from yours aside from going to church or abstaining from sex. Because I believe in something? So what? Even Agent admitted I couldn' t be wasting my life because of that. It' s impossible. Your true meaning of life is faulty at its very core.

Other religions fit fine. People can believe want they want. I don' t judge. For the most part I see other religions just as a different view on mine. Our gods might be one in the same, the story has been just been tainted by man and our understanding (which is unique to each person) changes the perception of it. A higher being is a higher being. Names whether it be Jesus, God, Thor, etc... are just man made labels. What they represent is what is important. We are all just striving for reuniting with the creator and reaching the afterlife.

As i said before Jesus already died for your Sins so go knock yourselves out boys, there aint no way you are going to hell

Can you be any more ignorant? That is one of the stupidest things I' ve seen you post. You obviously don' t know what the meaning of " dying for our sins" is. Do some actual research before you start babbling ignorant statements like that.

I' m done in this thread btw. Agent, I actually enjoyed this little back and forth between you and I. It was pretty fun but it' s just taking waaaaaaaaaaay to long writing up these posts, lol. I' m supposed to have 25 submissions a day at work... I have less than two hours left and I have 3 submissions.

I' m done in this thread btw. Agent, I actually enjoyed this little back and forth between you and I. It was pretty fun but it' s just taking waaaaaaaaaaay to long writing up these posts, lol. I' m supposed to have 25 submissions a day at work... I have less than two hours left and I have 3 submissions .

It doesn' t really matter .

Vx, actually I' m most definitely correct. How does believing in a God have anything to do with it? Nothing, you are still being a follower. It' s the action that defines it. Society, rules, laws, regulations, are man made but they aren' t real. They are as real as God if he doesn' t exist. Show me society. You' d probably say look all around... I' d say the same thing if I were saying where to look for God.

God is a phantom, his rules are written in a great book of lies. No offence.


There are biological reasons as to why people need to believe in a god.

Do you think its profoundly funny that if you were raised by your parents that a little green dude living in the bushes behind your house controlled everything, and that if the majority of the poeople in your community believed it tol, you would think it was true?

We are all just striving for the afterlife.

Good luck with that!

Can you be any more ignorant? That is one of the stupidest things I' ve seen you post. You obviously don' t know what the meaning of " dying for our sins" is. Do some actual research before you start babbling ignorant statements like that.

I was quoting south park.

ORIGINAL: Agent Ghost

It doesn' t really matter .

I know I said that was my last post but that had me laughing pretty hard, well played

I was quoting south park.

Also wanted to say my bad for not picking up on that Vx.

Damn guys...

I leave for a few hours, come back, and we' re two pages ahead.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=G-dEQ7N316I

Checkmate